Random Conversation 2.0

[jaisee]

If you really think homosexuality stops in the bedroom. you haven't been paying attention. It is a movement, it is political, It has permeated largely into mainstream society and the education system. Regardless if that's a good thing or bad thing to anyone, if it actually stopped in the bedroom, l think some people likely wouldn't care as much.

Fair point, and I think it's cause and effect. The first tool of any persecuted people is to put their movement in your face and say "I'm here, I'm not ashamed of who I am, and I'm not going anywhere". Gay pride is a lot like the black pride movement in that regard. In fact, I take the position that it would have actually stopped in the bedroom long ago if people hadn't cared so much.

I do want to be clear though, I only mean the "in their bedroom" thing with strict regard to sexual relations and that statement is more to prove a point. If gay people had to leave their love for one another at home, they are not being treated as equals. By all means, they deserve to be afforded the same freedoms as everybody else.

 

[jaisee]

I've read that scripture backwards and forwards. Went to Catholic school fam and all I'm saying is if you truly believe in God then you would never feel the need speak on his behalf. He is all powerful so he literally doesn't need you to.
Like I said if so many so called Christians gave a shit about people gay marriage would 192 on the list of offenses that need to be addressed.

Too often people pervert scripture to support their own prejudices. There is only one thing that christians need to remember as it relates to their personal feelings toward others, and that is: "love one another as I have loved you". You cannot be a "hate the sinner and the sin" christian.

One of the calls on a christian is to minister to the non-believer and to bring the non-believer to god. Yet, they are surprised and offended when people opt not to become holier than thou, judgemental assholes. Maybe they'd find more success and support if they used their christianity for more than supporting their holier than thoul, judgemental assholism? Maybe god should kick the archchristians out of his club for misrepresentation.

 

[wtarshi]

In the end, religion still feels that it has the power to rule, when in reality, it's relativity in our world is dying out.

 

[The Dark King]

In the end, religion still feels that it has the power to rule, when in reality, it's relativity in our world is dying out.

Unfortunately that's true. I wonder what people will use to guide them morally without it. Some people don't need it but it looks like most do.

 

[goodlove]

IR is not a political movement and never was one. IR never sought to change the definition of marriage, which has always been between a man and a woman. If we seek to change the definition of marriage from what it was to something different, that's fine. but calling gay marriage, marriage is a misnomer..it is a marriage between a man and a man or woman and a woman. That is in fact, a different definition from traditional marriage.

I watched a documentary last night on gays that included gay black men in Harlem. There was an interracial couple who got married, who had been together for decades. The gay black groom's (black) best friend (also gay) asked him why he was getting married now, and his response was "security, so that whatbwas his becomes mine, and mine becomes his"

Even the lawsuit that made it to the Supreme Court was about (monetary entitlement) rights. The other catalyst lawsuit was filed by a gay woman who was upset that she had to pay taxes on a property passed to her by her lover... again money motivation. Love, not so much. Which is fair enough. Single people should now also be allowed to marry themselves, and thus also receive tax breaks that married couples are afforded. Don't care what kind of marriage definition given to it, just give singles equal rights to the same tax benefits.

So i take it you are against same sex marriage?

 

[goodlove]

Like i stated..... for christians to come out against gay marriage means they havent read their bible nor have no since if history or understanding of the constitution .

......Masterfully enunciated....the problem is, it cannot be contained in the bedroom,.... the movement would prefer that it be in your face.....

TDK,
If you consult scripture,...You'll find God is very specific and very blunt with regard to homosexuality......We are the ones who have adjusted our tolerances over the recent generations......

 

[jaisee]

So i take it you are against same sex marriage?

Frankly, I'm against all marriage as we know it.

Marriage, in my opinion happens on 3 levels.

Spiritual, which is personal to the parties involved... this is the only level where it has any relevance.

Legal, for obvious reasons. Healthcare, tax status, etc.,. Relevant for purposes within the law only.

Religious, for superficial and supernatural reasons. The bullshitiest and least relevant reason to marry.

Take out the religious, and a lot of opponents to same sex marriage lose the entire basis for their stance on why people different than them should not be treated equally.

Legal unfortunately has to remain, it's just the society that we live in.

On a spiritual level, if I meet someone that I feel bonded to and want to devote myself to them and they to me. That's really all that should matter. Other peoples thoughts on our relationship be damned.

 

[goodlove]

Cant disagree

Frankly, I'm against all marriage as we know it.

Marriage, in my opinion happens on 3 levels.

Spiritual, which is personal to the parties involved... this is the only level where it has any relevance.

Legal, for obvious reasons. Healthcare, tax status, etc.,. Relevant for purposes within the law only.

Religious, for superficial and supernatural reasons. The bullshitiest and least relevant reason to marry.

Take out the religious, and a lot of opponents to same sex marriage lose the entire basis for their stance on why people different than them should not be treated equally.

Legal unfortunately has to remain, it's just the society that we live in.

On a spiritual level, if I meet someone that I feel bonded to and want to devote myself to them and they to me. That's really all that should matter. Other peoples thoughts on our relationship be damned.

 

[Peach State Scholar]

TDK,
If you consult scripture,...You'll find God is very specific and very blunt with regard to homosexuality......We are the ones who have adjusted our tolerances over the recent generations......

The bible is against a lot of things. Do you feel the same way about divorce, for example? And if we're going to use the biblical definition of marriage then you're going to have a rough go of it, I'm afraid:

Having one or two concubines sounds like it may be fun but 300? They don't make enough viagra in the world for that to be feasible?

If you really think homosexuality stops in the bedroom. you haven't been paying attention. It is a movement, it is political, It has permeated largely into mainstream society and the education system. Regardless if that's a good thing or bad thing to anyone, if it actually stopped in the bedroom, l think some people likely wouldn't care as much.

The educational system....so what, school are teaching kids how to be gay now? :smt043

And as far as being mainstream, gay people have been in existence as long as people have been in existence. Gays being allowed to marry has absolutely no effect on any straight marriages currently in existence. The only way that gay marriage will affect a straight person is if that straight person is in a relationship with someone gay who decides to leave their current spouse and marry someone gay.

 

[goodlove]

The bible is against a lot of things. Do you feel the same way about divorce, for example? And if we're going to use the biblical definition of marriage then you're going to have a rough go of it, I'm afraid:

Having one or two concubines sounds like it may be fun but 300? They don't make enough viagra in the world for that to be feasible?



The educational system....so what, school are teaching kids how to be gay now? :smt043

And as far as being mainstream, gay people have been in existence as long as people have been in existence. Gays being allowed to marry has absolutely no effect on any straight marriages currently in existence. The only way that gay marriage will affect a straight person is if that straight person is in a relationship with someone gay who decides to leave their current spouse and marry someone gay.

Gay marriage doesny effect hetero-marriage. Hetero-marriage divorce rate is at 50%...who is at fault for that?

 

[Peach State Scholar]

I believe these exact things were being said about inter racial relationships as well tho.

Yes they were. Hell, Bob Jones University (a very small school in South Carolina) had a ban on interracial relationships as recently as 2000. They only lifted that ban because of the negative publicity that they received when George H.W. Bush spoke there during the 2000 Presidential election. If not for that, they never would have changed it.

IR is not a political movement and never was one. IR never sought to change the definition of marriage, which has always been between a man and a woman. If we seek to change the definition of marriage from what it was to something different, that's fine. but calling gay marriage, marriage is a misnomer..it is a marriage between a man and a man or woman and a woman. That is in fact, a different definition from traditional marriage.

Before Loving, many states (especially southern ones) had bans on interracial marriage and a lot of the thought behind those laws was that miscegenation was against God's law. A lot of folks back then thought that it was implied that marriage was between one man and one woman of the same race. Many of the arguments being used against gay marriage now were being used against interracial marriage then.

[YOUTUBE]A8JsRx2lois[/YOUTUBE]

 

[Beasty]

The bible is against a lot of things. Do you feel the same way about divorce, for example? And if we're going to use the biblical definition of marriage then you're going to have a rough go of it, I'm afraid:

Having one or two concubines sounds like it may be fun but 300? They don't make enough viagra in the world for that to be feasible?



The educational system....so what, school are teaching kids how to be gay now? :smt043

And as far as being mainstream, gay people have been in existence as long as people have been in existence. Gays being allowed to marry has absolutely no effect on any straight marriages currently in existence. The only way that gay marriage will affect a straight person is if that straight person is in a relationship with someone gay who decides to leave their current spouse and marry someone gay.

LOL. You know it's bound to happen in your town. I'm probably late calling it.

 

[Peach State Scholar]

Gay marriage doesny effect hetero-marriage. Hetero-marriage divorce rate is at 50%...who is at fault for that?

LOL. You know it's bound to happen in your town. I'm probably late calling it.

They would all have a point if marriages were a finite resource. If states only allowed a certain number of marriage licenses to be issued in any given year then that's one thing. If a gay marriage necessarily meant that somewhere in the world, a straight marriage had to dissolve in order to make room for it then I could see their point. But there's no logical reason as to why two consenting adults should be allowed to marry each other.

 

[Archman]

The bible is against a lot of things. Do you feel the same way about divorce, for example? And if we're going to use the biblical definition of marriage then you're going to have a rough go of it, I'm afraid:

Since,
It is fair-Game to present this illustration....For after-all, It is what is recorded scripture,....... but ask your self this honest question......In all of these scenarios, Was it really God's decree, or was it the fallen sinful nature of man that spawn these dilemmas ??......Man was originally created an invisible creature, design to live forever, with no worries, but as the story is told, we fell from grace through sin and we brought imperfections on our selves.......Further, if you elaborate on God and his written word, it is only fair that you have acknowledge the adversary and his role in our imperfection.....The Devil has been busy with our demise since our first parents were given the freedom to decide.....

 

[goodlove]

do you support a theocracy?

As a christian i dont support someones religion invading my space...

Since,
It is fair-Game to present this illustration....For after-all, It is what is recorded scripture,....... but ask your self this honest question......In all of these scenarios, Was it really God's decree, or was it the fallen sinful nature of man that spawn these dilemmas ??......Man was originally created an invisible creature, design to live forever, with no worries, but as the story is told, we fell from grace through sin and we brought imperfections on our selves.......Further, if you elaborate on God and his written word, it is only fair that you have acknowledge the adversary and his role in our imperfection.....The Devil has been busy with our demise since our first parents were given the freedom to decide.....

 

[Peach State Scholar]

Since,
It is fair-Game to present this illustration....For after-all, It is what is recorded scripture,....... but ask your self this honest question......In all of these scenarios, Was it really God's decree, or was it the fallen sinful nature of man that spawn these dilemmas ??......Man was originally created an invisible creature, design to live forever, with no worries, but as the story is told, we fell from grace through sin and we brought imperfections on our selves.......Further, if you elaborate on God and his written word, it is only fair that you have acknowledge the adversary and his role in our imperfection.....The Devil has been busy with our demise since our first parents were given the freedom to decide.....

Not being devout, I really couldn't tell you. But to be honest, I also couldn't care less. If you or anyone else wants to only recognize straight marriages as legitimate marriages then, as I explained to someone on FB a few days ago, the recent Supreme Court decision does nothing to change that. In the United States marriage is a legal contract first and foremost, any other faith-based concerns take a back seat to that.

As far as everything you posted, well I don't believe in the devil either literally or metaphorically so that doesn't really change my overall view on whether the states should prohibits gays from marrying.

 

[jaisee]

Not being devout, I really couldn't tell you. But to be honest, I also couldn't care less. If you or anyone else wants to only recognize straight marriages as legitimate marriages then, as I explained to someone on FB a few days ago, the recent Supreme Court decision does nothing to change that. In the United States marriage is a legal contract first and foremost, any other faith-based concerns take a back seat to that.

As far as everything you posted, well I don't believe in the devil either literally or metaphorically so that doesn't really change my overall view on whether the states should prohibits gays from marrying.

And that's exactly the point. Believe what you want to believe, no matter how far-fetched it is... just don't let your beliefs affect others. People are acting like the legalization of same sex unions is going to now force them into a gay marriage. Otherwise, I cannot see any reasonable notion behind such outrage over it.

 

[goodlove]

And that's exactly the point. Believe what you want to believe, no matter how far-fetched it is... just don't let your beliefs affect others. People are acting like the legalization of same sex unions is going to now force them into a gay marriage. Otherwise, I cannot see any reasonable notion behind such outrage over it.

Exactly....if they started a theocracy they would complain about their lack of freedom cause they dont believe some elses religous beliefs.

 

[Peach State Scholar]

 

[Morning Star]

I would look better in that. Just saying...