help..wonderful white women/parents

ReginaStar said:
If that was the case their would be no need to racial identify yourself.
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There isn't. Your "racial identity" is how others view you. Let's look at gender identity a moment. I'm assuming you're familiar with transgenderism. If I dress like a woman, have obviously female secondary sexual characteristics such as breasts, wear make up, etc, the world is going to view me as a woman. If I was transgender, I might very well be mentally/emotionally "male" but until I change my appearance to match that, I'm going to be treated AS A WOMAN. That's why FtM and MtF transgender folk cross dress, get surgery and take hormones. To alter the way *other* people view their gender, and to make it match the gender they feel inside.

I could tell people I was a two headed green Martian, a plaid Saturnian, or a black American, but if my APPEARANCE is that of a white middle class middle aged female, THAT is how I'm going to be viewed and treated, with all the privilege (race and class)and lack of privilege (gender and age) which those attributes are granted by this society.

I understand you feel the necessity to have the last word, Regina, so I'll let you. My points have been made, and I suspect, well understood by the rest of the forum. So have at, dear woman, but understand that you seem pretty much out on your own limb on this topic.
 
TreePixie said:
I could tell people I was a two headed green Martian, a plaid Saturnian, or a black American, but if my APPEARANCE is that of a white middle class middle aged female, THAT is how I'm going to be viewed and treated, with all the privilege (race and class)and lack of privilege (gender and age) which those attributes are granted by this society.
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Pixie for prez, Pixie for prez,

She schooled that Regina lady all the way back to Savannah, GA!!!!! :rock:
 
DOA said:
Pixie for prez, Pixie for prez,

She schooled that Regina lady all the way back to Savannah, GA!!!!! :rock:
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Oh dear gods and little green monsters, no! Can you imagine a president who was as blunt as I am? Congress would implode from squeezing their butt cheeks together so tightly.
 
TreePixie said:
There isn't. Your "racial identity" is how others view you. Let's look at gender identity a moment. I'm assuming you're familiar with transgenderism. If I dress like a woman, have obviously female secondary sexual characteristics such as breasts, wear make up, etc, the world is going to view me as a woman. If I was transgender, I might very well be mentally/emotionally "male" but until I change my appearance to match that, I'm going to be treated AS A WOMAN. That's why FtM and MtF transgender folk cross dress, get surgery and take hormones. To alter the way *other* people view their gender, and to make it match the gender they feel inside.

I could tell people I was a two headed green Martian, a plaid Saturnian, or a black American, but if my APPEARANCE is that of a white middle class middle aged female, THAT is how I'm going to be viewed and treated, with all the privilege (race and class)and lack of privilege (gender and age) which those attributes are granted by this society.

I understand you feel the necessity to have the last word, Regina, so I'll let you. My points have been made, and I suspect, well understood by the rest of the forum. So have at, dear woman, but understand that you seem pretty much out on your own limb on this topic.
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There was a point in US history where a person was not allowed to racially identify themselves. A person would look at you and mark down white, black (whatever word they were using at that time) or mulatto, and at different points other descriptions. That is having your right to identify yourself take away. That is not the same as identifying yourself. A common thing you will hear from racially ambiguous people is others ASK them to identify themselves. That is the point you will take it upon yourself to identify yourself and it does not matter what someone else may assume you to be. But lets go with the transgender thing. A man can make oneself look like a woman and therefore be treated as a woman. Much like you will be treated in society based on how you look. If you look like a minority in the US you will be treated as minority. If you were to change the way you look ex. you watch that show where the changed their skin tone to see how they would be treated in different skin. That is like a man dressing like a woman and getting treated as a woman but no matter who he dresses like he is still a man. A man can say they are a woman but it doesn't make them a woman. A biracial person can say they are a monoracial race but doesn't make them a monoraical race. I personally think most multiracial people look multiracial. I know I personally tend to identify people that look that way and I'm right. However I have identified someone as white when they were biracial and I have identified someone as black when they were multiracial and do remember twice I identified someone as multiracial and they claimed to be black. One of those was a child in the picture with his parents who I thought based on appearance was a black man and a white woman but apparently the white woman was actually a black woman. Opps. A biracial appearance does it equate to racism, that I wholeheartedly agree with.

Maybe so but as long as I have a response I don't tend to feel the need not to respond.
 
ReginaStar said:
n. That is like a man dressing like a woman and getting treated as a woman but no matter who he dresses like he is still a man. A man can say they are a woman but it doesn't make them a woman.
Maybe so but as long as I have a response I don't tend to feel the need not to respond.
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That's where you're wrong on transgenderism, but that's a bit of a derail. It's been proved that in utero, the brain and body are gendered at different times during gestation, which can set up a conflict....they truly have the brain of one gender and the appearance of another (and lets leave aside the intersexed at the moment for clarity's sake). If a transman or a transwoman lives as the opposite gender, changes their appearance through hormones, dress, and or surgery, they became the gender of their brain. I know several transwomen who are every bit a woman just as you or I do, and during their transition they live as and are treated as women. Because their appearance has changed, their voice has changed, their mannerism has changed, etc.

"Biracial" children do not have the option to change their skin color. They will always be seen as black, regardless of whether they grow up in a mansion or a mud hut. They will be treated as black, period. Right, wrong, or indifferent, that is the reality.
 
TreePixie said:
There isn't. Your "racial identity" is how others view you. Let's look at gender identity a moment. I'm assuming you're familiar with transgenderism. If I dress like a woman, have obviously female secondary sexual characteristics such as breasts, wear make up, etc, the world is going to view me as a woman. If I was transgender, I might very well be mentally/emotionally "male" but until I change my appearance to match that, I'm going to be treated AS A WOMAN. That's why FtM and MtF transgender folk cross dress, get surgery and take hormones. To alter the way *other* people view their gender, and to make it match the gender they feel inside.

I could tell people I was a two headed green Martian, a plaid Saturnian, or a black American, but if my APPEARANCE is that of a white middle class middle aged female, THAT is how I'm going to be viewed and treated, with all the privilege (race and class)and lack of privilege (gender and age) which those attributes are granted by this society.

I understand you feel the necessity to have the last word, Regina, so I'll let you. My points have been made, and I suspect, well understood by the rest of the forum. So have at, dear woman, but understand that you seem pretty much out on your own limb on this topic.
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damnation...."pixie" my sweet white arse.....u gotta come up with a new name woman.....:prayer:
DOA said:
Pixie for prez, Pixie for prez,

She schooled that Regina lady all the way back to Savannah, GA!!!!! :rock:
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she most definitely did !!!!
 
swirlman07 said:
First, I agree with Yrma that's it's ironic to see a White person spending so much time attempting to explain why her definition of "race" is appropriate. I also find a lot of inconsistency in your position, but that's not the essence of my comment.

Acknowledging ethnicity is one thing, but to say that it's a "pride" thing suggests that there is an importance attached to races. The fact is the word pride implies superiority, which I find disturbing. This logically means that people should choose to define themselves by races out a sense of recognizing the "better" racial aspects of their background. Otherwise, what's the point in saying that it's about pride. I see no pride associated with race, only as a description that society chooses to impose on the person.

I believe that race has ABSOLUTELY NO INFLUENCE on who you are as person, unless you are a black person in America. Then, you are defined by your blackness, whether you are dope dealer or the President of the United States. For black Americans race can be a source of motivation because you understand how much you must overcome to have a measure of equality freely given to others by virtue of their race.

Both of my children are the products of two races, Black/Asian and Black/Spanish. I will always refer to my children as black as they have features that identify them with the Black race. It's much more important for me that they understand how they will be viewed by society and deal with those realities, in spite of any ethic description. For me, anything else is a disservice and creates a false sense that they might get "credit" for being part of another race. Of course they understand that their parents are of different races, but it's irrelevant. I care much more for their psychological well being and instilling in them the knowledge that they can't forget their blackness, because society certainly won't forget it.

In fact, arguably, people who choose to identify themselves as "bi-racial" could be subjected to more disdain, if part of the identification is with the White race. Many White Americans would find such associations to be offensive because they see something different. But, this is the state of racial politics in the United States today. So, I choose to be a realist.
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Great post, Swirl, definitely helped answer some questions little ol' naive Australian me had about this topic, especially the bolded ;)

TreePixie, great posts and welcome to the forum!
 
If the world were a just place Swirl and Pixie would be making babies right now!!!
We need more people like this in the world.
You guys made air tight points anything to the contrary at this point would just be plain hot air.
 
ReginaStar said:
Nah I just find it an interesting topic. I done went though all the series of how should I handle it, I tried to read as many articles as I could find on what different biracial people say and about their experience. When I first had biracial kids I wasn't even aware that they were some biracial people that identified solely as black. I'm use to this argument done had it a million times on another site I'm just use to having it with black women lol. They love to tell us shit like how were incapable of raising "black" children.

And I had already commented on what was said, so I don't know what the me not responding is all about.
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I got you. It is a tuff situation because the kids are catching all the hell. as parents we have to help them navigate thru it all. as parents we are hurting because the kids are hurting. it sucks

Ymra said:
THIS....VERY WELL WRITTEN.......

Again the idea that "multi-racial" or "bi-racial" somehow connects two races is utterly laughable. I did enjoy your comment...



and this really destroys the myth of "paying hommage to both cultures" as I've already stated we study both black history and Japanese history in my home. Something real and tangible for my children to learn and understand the past of both cultures. Calling them "bi-racial" does not do that.
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stiletoes said:
I did not read the whole thread. How about we just call them children?
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bravo. but society will not do it. they have another agenda

ReginaStar said:
I just don't agree. Of all the people I have known to identify with their multiple races they were not trying to escape their blackness. My older children's aunt who is Korean/white is not trying to escape her asianess by identifying as both either. Their they may be some b/c sure some identify solely as white, asian, etc when they half black but it's still a relatively small portion to those that are just trying to encompass their whole selves. Biracial, and multiracial maybe common terms to say this person is more than 1 but they are still identifying with their multiple races. When multiracial people fill out forms they are identifying with their separate racial groups not just one broad term like multiracial. So what seems to be the problem? As far as Tiger goes what is wrong with him using a term to encompass all of himself? Do you have problem with biracial people using terms like mulatto, Hapa, Afropean, etc too? I don't agree with Tiger Woods being a multiracial African American with a Thia mother. He doesn't just have a Thia mother, he is also Thia. He is not a multiracial African American he is a multiracial person. I can see that term being used for someone that has a grandparent or great grandparent but for someone like Tiger that is 1/2 Asian, 1/4 black, 1/8 white, 1/8 native American it just makes no sense to call him a African American. I can see calling him a multiracial Asian-African American.
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overwhelming ooohhhhh. it sucks to have to do that as a person.

Soulthinker said:
No matter what name a biracial person calls him or herself,the treatment of law enforcement will not change.
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LOL. Stop beating me Im half black half white.

police responds: we are beating the nigger side of you. turn over boy and take that ass whiping.

ReginaStar said:
Sorry for that not being enough information for me to understand what you are saying. I've asked specific questions to try and see exactly where your coming from that would help understand where these sentences were left too wide open for interpretation.

I don't consider it a "credit" thing any how. I see it as a pride thing. Pride in where you come from, pride in the person you are. Your racial make up is part of what makes you the person you are just as your gender does.
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credit when used was kind of an insult back in the day.
 
MrFantastic said:
If the world were a just place Swirl and Pixie would be making babies right now!!!
We need more people like this in the world.
You guys made air tight points anything to the contrary at this point would just be plain hot air.
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Thanks! This woman isn't going to make any more babies! I just got through raising my kid, not planning on doing that again! But the practicing part? That, I'm up for. ;-)
 
Just when I thought I was out...

TDR said:
Don't worry Pixie schooled that Regina lady all the way to stone age, lol
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LOL - I think she just sees a lot less racism than the rest of us experience. I wish I lived where she lives.

[YOUTUBE]UPw-3e_pzqU[/YOUTUBE]
 
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