SmoothDaddy101
Well-Known Member
After reading that, my respect for Denzel just went down the drain.
Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
I think brothers are dwelling on this too much. When did we become a bunch of women crying because we're not represented on the big screen? Boo hoo, how come there are no dark-skinned sistas? Boo hoo how come no plus-size women. Sound familiar? I don't know about you but I'm too busy trying to get this paper in this global recession to be worrying about Hollywood and I don't need to be validated by the media.
It was more than Pelican Brief. But sticking with Pelican Brief both Julia Roberts and the firector were all for the idea of Denzel and Julia's characters kissing and/or showing signs of a relationship. Cowardly Denzel was the one who sided with author John Grisham (who reportedly was not happy in the first place that a black male was cast in the role in the first place) and helped kill the idea. The only real reason why Denzel was hired in the first place was because Julia asked for him for the role and this dude can't even follow through by at least siding her on this issue.
But Denzel has always worried about his image but does so for all the wrong reasons. He has been almost scared of doing IR if the other woman is white. If she's Indian or Latino? No problem. White girl? He goes all slave plantation like. He dropped out of "Love Field" and essentially dissed Michelle Phifer. He said he did so because his character wasn't well defined and he had a point. But he must have known that when he first got the script. I tend to think the IR angle (as small as it was) played a part. Dennis Haysbert would end up getting the role instead.
My main issue with Denzel though was what happened with Virtuosity. The film, co-starring an unknown at the time Russell Crowe, was crap. But interestingly enough the people behind the film wanted there to be a romance between Kelly Lynch's character (a white woman) and Denzel's. It didn't happen and I would have never known that it was supposed to happen if it weren't for Kelly bringing it up in an interview. She said Denzel had the producers drop the relationship between the teo of them. And she said the reason Denzel gave was that he thought he would offend/alienate the white male ticket buyers if his character had a relationship with the woman. Now I mentioned this before years ago in threads which I criticized Denzel and as I wrote back then I believe that Kelly's recollection is absolutely true. It fits Denzel's MO (just check out his advice to Will Smith for Six Degrees). And if true it indicates a couple of things First of all it showed that Denzel wasn't just bowing to black females; he was bowing to his white masters as well with his plantation mentality about not offending white guys. Also this incident (and Pelican Brief) showed that white males producing and directing movies will from time to time offer a black male star (has to be a star) an opportunity for onscreen relationships between himself and white women. But if the black male star doesn't pony up and take that opportunity it all goes to waste. This is why I have a problem with Denzel (one of a few reasons actually). He had chances to open the door for more possibilities for black actors coming behind him but he was too invested in being a chicken shit.
You do realize what a small niche market BM/WW are dont you? BM are only 7-8 percent of the US population, and it is a minority of them who date/marry white women.
Movies are about money. And the movie business has been faltering for over a decade. They arent going to target 3-4 percent of the population (BM who date WW).
But we can keep blaming WW.....
Hey the man knew where he had to make money at. i agree with you if this is true that its not cool he bowed out of certain scenes. But hey he knew his audience and what they want and dont want. Remember he is most blk women dream guy . Why because he knew the MATRIX of his popularity and took advantage of it.
Think aobut what happened to Wesley after Jungle fever. Or the guy in Save The Last Dance. I ahvent sceen much of them since. Taking those roles can kill some black guys careers because most black women go see films with black costars in it.
He knew the BM/WW is the ultimate taboo in the AAF community. He knew that would hurt his rep and earning potentional. Look at the latest victim Terrance Howard.. and even Tye Diggs..
There is a economic reason Denzel did what he did . Will is smart not to do the same.
The image of them with WW is enough to kill their careers
I think hollywood caters enormously to women.
Ice Cube to star in 'Ride Along'
Mar 31, 2009, 08:28 AM | by Margeaux Watson
Ice Cube is onboard to star in New Line Cinema's action comedy Ride Along, reports. The rapper-actor will play a cop who seeks to ruin his engaged sister's relationship with an affluent white psychiatrist by inviting her fiancé on an ill-advised ride-along with him in his squad car. Cube will produce the movie with his colleague Matt Alvarez from Cube Vision. Production is set to begin this summer.
Ice cube is producing the flick so he and not "hollywood" takes the flack for this one. Just like Jayz promotes rihanna to wm but wont let Ne-yo appear in a video with ww. Niggas with plantation mentality are so common its incredible.Again...Hollyweird cops out on IR by making it WM/BW, which is far less common in the real world than BM/WW relationships.
The Kid Rasta
Denzel is like Will Smith in that he has a high Q rating with both genders of all races across the board. Translation: whites, Hispanics and Asians go see his films too and for most of his films actually make up the biggest part of his audience. While its true black women love them some Denzel it has never been proven that they represent the backbone of those that pay to see his films. So while they might act like they own him they don't. When Denzel is in mainstream movies (translation: those with a majority white cast surrounding him) the data that has been gathered is that more white women (and white men) will end up seeing his films than black women (and black men). Same thing with Will. There is also little proof that white people will reject him if he is wooing a white woman on screen. But we don't get a chance to see it because Denzel and some white executives/producers chose to not go that route because of their own fears and concerns.
Also, don’t you think that some white women have a feeling that they are the backbone of the support for certain white actors like Brad Pitt, Orlando Bloom, Tom Cruise, etc). And yet that would not stop Hollywood from casting a non-white actress as their onscreen significant other.
Wesley Snipes’ career actually took off after Jungle Fever. He appeared in even bigger and successful films such as White Men Can’t Jump, Passenger 57 and that film with Sean Connery in Japan. Unfortunately like most actors Snipes got into a bad streak of films and he became less of a hot property in Hollywood (see Mickey Rourke as just one example). He would bounce back with Blade (the first and second films were both big hits) but then his erratic behavior on set and his troubles I real life derailed his career once again.
The other dude you mentioned in Save the Last Dance is a short, average looking dude whom no one was necessarily going nuts over. When I saw him I laughed at someone who suggested he would be the next Denzel. Like in what universe? His being in that film did not hurt his career. It made his career. If it was not for that one film no one would have ever known who he was. He popped up again in the Barbershop pictures which were just as successful as Save the Last Dance but again no one though enough of him to give him lead roles. If anything it’s the lack of opportunities for black actors overall that has likely led to his disappearance.
How is Diggs a victim? Diggs has a white following that would dwarf his black following. But is he good enough to be the lead of a film? Does he have the chops? And as for his TV series there hasn’t been a successful dramatic TV series with a black lead in decades. The only exception may be The Unit and its questionable if that show is even successful. As for T Howard he is sabotaging his own career by his repeated ridiculous public statements. And he has made some awful film choices as of late. But he still has such a large black female following that his appearance on Broadway last year was a hit. They credited him with bringing out the black ladies to that black interpretation of Cat on a Hot Tin Roof. By the way he has never had an onscreen pairing with a white woman which is what this topic is all about. So if you’re referring to his exwife who is white that did not stop him from getting on the cover of Essence magazine and drawing the attention of many black females.
Will had that same feeling a few years back which is why the idea was to never cast a white lady opposite him in Hancock (it was in development for a long time). But look what happened. They cast Charlize Theron and the film ended up being ne of his biggest hits. Sure some black women complained and the romance was watered down, but there was still a relationship between the two characters. And you know what? White audiences didn’t object. If anything people objected to the uneven script. Will was scared for no reason. Even if a large segment of black women would be turned off by him by having an onscreen relationship with a white woman he is such a big star that his film would still make hundreds of millions internationally as long as the film is solid.
If it is that’s a sad indictment of society but I don’t think that is the case. Audiences who saw the Pelican Brief wanted Denzel and Julia’s character to hook up. I’m sure there were plenty of folks who would have been uncomfortable with it but they would have been in the minority. The ridiculous stance though is to play scared and not try. Common sentiment would have suggested to Obama to not try to run for President either, right? No way he could be elected. But you see things don’t happen unless someone is willing to try. So I don’t buy the notion that a black actor’s career is over if he has onscreen relations with white females. Even if he does hurt his standing amongst black women perhaps he will pick up a big following amongst white women who are the majority by the way. TV may not be the best example but Blair Underwood’s career is thriving better than ever even though on TV and in one of his most recent motion pictures his love interests were white women. At one time Blair himself would have been against being paired with white women but a interview a few years back revealed he now saw how foolish that was/ He realized taking that stance put him in a box and limited his potential audience. He also saw the hypocrisy in how black women were more easily paired with white guys in films.
Denzel is like Will Smith in that he has a high Q rating with both genders of all races across the board. Translation: whites, Hispanics and Asians go see his films too and for most of his films actually make up the biggest part of his audience. While its true black women love them some Denzel it has never been proven that they represent the backbone of those that pay to see his films. So while they might act like they own him they don't. When Denzel is in mainstream movies (translation: those with a majority white cast surrounding him) the data that has been gathered is that more white women (and white men) will end up seeing his films than black women (and black men). Same thing with Will. There is also little proof that white people will reject him if he is wooing a white woman on screen. But we don't get a chance to see it because Denzel and some white executives/producers chose to not go that route because of their own fears and concerns.
Also, don’t you think that some white women have a feeling that they are the backbone of the support for certain white actors like Brad Pitt, Orlando Bloom, Tom Cruise, etc). And yet that would not stop Hollywood from casting a non-white actress as their onscreen significant other.
Wesley Snipes’ career actually took off after Jungle Fever. He appeared in even bigger and successful films such as White Men Can’t Jump, Passenger 57 and that film with Sean Connery in Japan. Unfortunately like most actors Snipes got into a bad streak of films and he became less of a hot property in Hollywood (see Mickey Rourke as just one example). He would bounce back with Blade (the first and second films were both big hits) but then his erratic behavior on set and his troubles I real life derailed his career once again.
The other dude you mentioned in Save the Last Dance is a short, average looking dude whom no one was necessarily going nuts over. When I saw him I laughed at someone who suggested he would be the next Denzel. Like in what universe? His being in that film did not hurt his career. It made his career. If it was not for that one film no one would have ever known who he was. He popped up again in the Barbershop pictures which were just as successful as Save the Last Dance but again no one though enough of him to give him lead roles. If anything it’s the lack of opportunities for black actors overall that has likely led to his disappearance.
How is Diggs a victim? Diggs has a white following that would dwarf his black following. But is he good enough to be the lead of a film? Does he have the chops? And as for his TV series there hasn’t been a successful dramatic TV series with a black lead in decades. The only exception may be The Unit and its questionable if that show is even successful. As for T Howard he is sabotaging his own career by his repeated ridiculous public statements. And he has made some awful film choices as of late. But he still has such a large black female following that his appearance on Broadway last year was a hit. They credited him with bringing out the black ladies to that black interpretation of Cat on a Hot Tin Roof. By the way he has never had an onscreen pairing with a white woman which is what this topic is all about. So if you’re referring to his exwife who is white that did not stop him from getting on the cover of Essence magazine and drawing the attention of many black females.
Will had that same feeling a few years back which is why the idea was to never cast a white lady opposite him in Hancock (it was in development for a long time). But look what happened. They cast Charlize Theron and the film ended up being ne of his biggest hits. Sure some black women complained and the romance was watered down, but there was still a relationship between the two characters. And you know what? White audiences didn’t object. If anything people objected to the uneven script. Will was scared for no reason. Even if a large segment of black women would be turned off by him by having an onscreen relationship with a white woman he is such a big star that his film would still make hundreds of millions internationally as long as the film is solid.
If it is that’s a sad indictment of society but I don’t think that is the case. Audiences who saw the Pelican Brief wanted Denzel and Julia’s character to hook up. I’m sure there were plenty of folks who would have been uncomfortable with it but they would have been in the minority. The ridiculous stance though is to play scared and not try. Common sentiment would have suggested to Obama to not try to run for President either, right? No way he could be elected. But you see things don’t happen unless someone is willing to try. So I don’t buy the notion that a black actor’s career is over if he has onscreen relations with white females. Even if he does hurt his standing amongst black women perhaps he will pick up a big following amongst white women who are the majority by the way. TV may not be the best example but Blair Underwood’s career is thriving better than ever even though on TV and in one of his most recent motion pictures his love interests were white women. At one time Blair himself would have been against being paired with white women but a interview a few years back revealed he now saw how foolish that was/ He realized taking that stance put him in a box and limited his potential audience. He also saw the hypocrisy in how black women were more easily paired with white guys in films.
Tom Cruise jumped on a couch and his career went in the toilet and he was TOM CRUISE.
co-sign.
The only thing I would add is that Sean Patrick Thomas carried on a successful tv career appearing as a regular character on The District. Now, he's back on tv with a small role on The Reaper (which may turn into a larger role).
I remember when he was in Cruel Intentions, and it was about a week before it came out. Sarah Michelle Gellar was on Jay Leno, and she made Jay bring her friend Sean Patrick Thomas out of the audience to sit in her chair, because he was going to be big. It was very cool.
Ice cube is producing the flick so he and not "hollywood" takes the flack for this one. Just like Jayz promotes rihanna to wm but wont let Ne-yo appear in a video with ww. Niggas with plantation mentality are so common its incredible.
Personally, I would just assume learn about any new projects through word of mouth or by accident somehow. I used to be one of those movie junkies a few years back in college where I even had this website out of Hollywood which had all the upcoming projects that the general public didn't know about (even the Spiderman movie was on the list). But I learned my lesson after casting and production changes would kill the cast or the movies ultimate chance at success. Plus, I got too accustomed to believing that race should NEVER play a role in the casting or in that very success. Boy was I wrong. So again, I just read an advertisement these days on G4's ticker or through a thread or watch a tv commercial for the latest flick I may or may not want to see. Because regardless of the movie, the formula for how it's casted and made remains the same. Like Jamal said, I doubt these racial trends will change anytime soon.If you folks want we could use these threads to post u any new info about films which contain black-white IR. And we can tally up the numbers to see how much it slants towards WM/BW. Now if the trend changes soon and all of a sudden black dudes are hooking up with white girls in films then I’ll own up to the fact that I was wrong. I doubt that will happen.