White Women Are "Easy"?

There is an opinion amongst many black women in America that black men date white women because white women are easy. They advise that white women are "freaks" in bed, and will do things that a black woman's sense of dignity will not allow her to do. They also explain that a white woman will put up with a black man's shyt, while a self-respecting, strong black woman will not. When black women see a black man walking arm-in-arm with a white woman, they will snicker amongst themselves, "That nigga couldn't handle a strong black woman. That's why he's with that white girl."

To black men who date white women, do you find this "myth" to be true? Are white women "easy"? Has this been your experience? To white women who date black men, what are your thoughts on this? Where do you think this characterization comes from? Have you experienced the type of scenario described above first-hand?

What are your thoughts?

 

Denial

Black women in America have had a kind generational domination over black men since the slave master was putting them over black male slaves to keep them docile. The charge that white women are "easy" by black women is one that is indicative of jealously and denial. I have had the pleasure of meeting black women that go against the grain and make an all out effort to be wonderful women, and in every case there was a sorry wench of a black woman trying to contaminate them. If they do not fall in line they get ridiculed. Like crabs in a bucket, black men inspire other black men to wrong and black women inspire other black women to wrong and pitch fits when you point it out. True, there are black men that make the same claim that white women are easy and they'd be right in comparsion to black women, but not for the suggested reasons black women give.

This type of accusation lies at the heart of why some black men move on to different races of women. Its not the sex that is the issue but the rebellion to satisfy their man with an incredibly weak excuse. Black women are some of the foremost advocates of calling men "dogs" but by their own admission through accusations against white women as "easy," they admit they are not handling their business with their men and thus help make them dogs. Also take in mind that their statement about not doing things sexually that white women will is a lie. These same black women will get together with the much vaunted thug and give it up anyway he wants behind closed doors. However, it is to the men that do not fit the media illusion of black maleness that these ladies are not willing to go all out to satisfy sexually because they're not as attracted or excited with them as they are with their thug counterparts. If that's their preference so be it but they shouldn't make excuses and slanders about them and the women they go out with when those same men go elsewhere.

Ah, so that's why Aids is spreading to more of the black women? They're not putting up with a black man's bs. And I suppose its because they will not put up with a black mans bs that they are growing numbers of single black mother families. I suppose its because they don't put up with a black man's bs that they get slapped around, beat, and cheated on while sticking around wasting precious time out of their lives before they finally realize its time to move on. In truth if they were as self-respecting and unwilling to put up with a black man's bs as many claim we would not see plenty of cases that say the exact opposite. Many black women are not self-respecting enough to not throw themselves at and/or gravitate to crooks and thugs who have nothing but bs to give because they're crooks and thugs.

Instead of shelling out insults and excuses against white women they should take productive notes from them. Then again if they would stop mocking and deriding good black women as being foolish or trying to act white and be inspired by them to be self-respecting feminine ladies they would be less of this problem.

-The Spade-

 

Well the way I see it, white women comprise the TOTAL PACKAGE. What I mean by this is that the white woman does not have to live her entire existence trying to prove something, because she already has. Overall, white women have much more going for them than black women - and black women know this. It has been (and still is) demonstrated daily that white women can be powerful leaders, innovators, educators, strong maternal figures, role models, etc.; and at the same time be funny, spontaneous, creative, wonderful lovers, and even difficult to put up with in their own right. I believe that's the reason why so many black women feel this way about white women involved in relationships with black men. Because deep down inside, black women know that the white female potentially has much more to offer to a man than they do, whether he be black or white.

 

Chillbill:

Nice post. You are not the first black man I know to hold such views toward black women in relation to their white counterparts. A black woman, however, may counter your remarks with the explanation that white women have always been held on a pedestal by American society (i.e. white men) and that they have not had to endure the horros of slavery and rape by white men. She may also advise that black women have had to endure the burden of not being considered "beautiful" and having to build up their own self-images in the wake of constant onslaught from the powers-that-be on Madison Avenue that decry that blackness is not as attractive as whiteness. Add to that the belief (although false) that white women are "stealing" the only good black men left for them. How would you respond to this explanation as to why black women view white women so negatively?

My thoughts: While I don't agree that white women have more to offer than black women, I do believe that today's black woman has failed black men. I do realize that there are a lot of no-good brothers out there who are mistreating our sisters, however, that is no excuse for the rampant materialism, arrogance, and the "what-can-you-do-for-me?" attitudes of black women. Black women continue to shout from the rooftops that there are no good black men, yet most wouldn't know a good black man if one was standing in front of them. If they do find a good black man, they don't appreciate him and accuse him of being "weak" because he may not exude the "thug" qualities that so many black women seem to be looking for.

I, like many black men, have decided that I no longer want to deal with the drama of the "strong black woman", who is more concerned with being disrespected than being respectful. I grew tired of the loud, obnoxious ghetto attitudes that even some of the most well-educated sisters espouse. I grew tired of being accused of being "weak" because I am not a thug, but an educated, conservative, career-minded brotha. I have found that I am much more appreciated by the white women I date. Despite the stares, whispers, and other obstacles endured by interracial couples, I feel its all worth it to be with someone who really enjoys my company and appreciates me for who I am right now rather than for my "potential".

Just my 2 cents. What do you think?

 

Hey, glad you liked my post. I've been in talks with guys who wonder why the black woman feels she has to be domineering and I've sort of come to my own conclusion about it all; From what I can see the black woman is the ONLY race of women who are constantly being told or portrayed that they are stronger than their men. And while I agree that in the past black women had to be strong because of all the atrocities black men had to face due to racism, the black women of today are nothing like our mothers and the black women of the past. Today's black woman does not reflect those great women of the past. I truly believe this is why you see so many black women choosing black men who are thuggish, lazy and don't want to work, drug dealing, in and out of jail, etc. Don't get me wrong here; there are plenty of black women who are with brothers who are respectful and responsible. But it's the black women who choose the so-called roughneck, thuggish, stay in all kinds of trouble type of guys who are usually most vocal at saying that there are no more good black men and criticizing brothers involved in interracial relationships. These women, who if faced with the challenges of the great black women of the past would probably fail miserably, have this personal ideology that they are the strong ones. And because of their personal need to feed this fantasy they deliberately choose men who Ray Charles could plainly see are irresponsible, shiftless, and always stay in trouble. This assures her that she will always be seen as the strong one in this relationship. When he gets out of line she can cuss him out, put him out, put him in jail, KEEP HIM IN HIS PLACE. She's always in control and there's really nothing he can do because he needs someplace to stay. But then there's the brother who knows what he wants out of life and doesn't necessarily need her in that way. He's demonstrating that he can be responsible for himself, being self-sufficient and self-assured. Such a man can't be controlled and viewed as weak. That's probably the reason why these particular black women display jealousy and have a problem with black men involved in interracial relationships. For these black men (who refuse to put up with the misguided strong black woman ideology of today's black woman); and yet wants to find a woman who is beautiful, strong (but not self-absorbed), loving, sweet, who can be a wonderful mate and through whom he can have a wonderful family and truly fulfilling relationship, white women are the PERFECT alternative.

 

Hello to everyone here... Now I may get chewed out or even shot for being on this board considering I'm not a ww, but I was reading several of these posts and it certainly struck more than a few nerves. :roll: Now, I'm not one to resort to cussing people out to make a simple point or get excessively overbearing to get the same point across. However, while the way some of you may feel is totally justified, it is also a huge slap in the face and an insult to many bw who have done absolutely NOTHING to you, because although I'm currently engaged, it really stung me.

I'd like to understand a few things... why does it seem as if a lot of bm make non-dateable bw the focus of their relationships with ww? What happens when you date a ww who has some of those same negative attributes that you connect with bw? I'm sure you don't dismiss them to then date only AW/HW or any other race of women because of how the one girl (or even 20) behave. But being that bw have got a 10 mile long list of stereotypes anyway, (as do bm) it's always more convenient to go along with them as opposed to judging people on a case-by-case basis. Basically, it amounts to: if I weren't currently engaged and wanted to date one of you, (or any bm who thinks along the same lines as many of you do) I couldn't. Doesn't matter that I work, attend college, and make my own way. Doesn't matter that I don't have 3 kids at the age of 24, or any at all for that matter. Doesn't matter that I've always been considered a sweet girl and fun to be around or very smart. Doesn't matter that I can speak English and not Ebonics. I don't know if people quite understand it yet, but this is partly why interracial unions have still not been fully acceptable and really been taken seriously. For the record, I'm definitely not jealous of any ww, and don't see the point in being so. However, my fiance is a wm, and he CERTAINLY (well, he better not have :x ) didn't choose me as relationship material by default. He could have had his pick of ANY (almost any) ww, but he chose ME because he liked what he saw and what I was as a person. It had nothing to do with the number of ww that cheated on him, ran up his cell phone bill, or were just downright psychotic. People will never totally come to grips with interracial unions when men/women have to belittle or demean as explanation for their bias in dating. It can never be that people just happen to meet somewhere or through a friend, like the same things and enjoy each other's company for any possible relationship nowadays; now, people have to make race primary and everything else secondary, and I honestly think that is truly sad.

As far as ww being easy, I don't think the majority of this rumor circulated by bw. How would bw know how easy a ww was unless she were sleeping with her? It has nothing to do with jealousy or denial in my opinion, because a lot of this same type of mess is circulated by the bm (yes, I said it... **ducking for cover** :shock: ) who slept with them to start with. I've heard this COUNTLESS times from the horse's mouth. BM have told me that it's easier to get them to do things in bed that bw may not do, easier to control, easier to get taken care of, etc. And even as a bw, I take offense to that, because no one deserves to be used up and thrown away, and more than enough of some of my dearest friends are ww, and they are NOTHING of the kind. I have even seen with my own eyes the way some ww throw themselves shamelessly at any male who looks black as long as he is playing football or basketball on campus. BW would automatically be condemned for that type behavior (groupie) , but for a ww, it would be total flattery.

Now there has always been two sides to every coin. The flip side of the coin is: why should bm not be seen the same way as bw?? For every bw that a bm complains about, I can think of 10 more who are just as trifling and sorry. Why is that never taken into consideration that bw are not the only ones playing victim? You, YOURSELVES may not be that sorry, drunk, lazy, mile long rap-sheet holding, weed-smoking, won't get a job, on the street hustling, ebonics speaking, always cursing, referring to other people as 'your n*gga', always blasting rap music, sperm donating, misogynistic, unambitious, good only for playing football/basketball bm. Now since I'm more than positive that many of you don't fit this mold, so is it not only fair that you don't pigeonhole bw? You want to be seen for what you are, not what you aren't or for how 50 other bm present you. (see aforementioned description :arrow: ) Why do other bw (or ANY race of women who's race of men does this) who do not fit your description as trifling have to pay for what THEY do??

I have seen more than my share of money-grubbing ww also, but it seems that so many bm are so jaded about ww ever doing any wrong, that they couldn't see it coming if it smacked them in the head. Like I said, I don't have any reason to hate on or be jealous of ww, but when ww do anything that most would automatically connect with being something that is too typical of bw, either it is ignored, or just totally written off. Even Anna Nicole Smith who married some guy who was about to croak because he was a billionaire is seen as untypical, when I personally know a few ww who deliberately look for bm to take care of them because they know they can. My whole point: remember that there are MORE than enough bm who make even the best of the best look bad, and the same can be said for bw. However, bw are NO worse than bm.

 

Browneyes,

This problem is at its core a concern for action that black men must deal with because it is we who must lead and set the standard as men. In this particular issue noble black men should condemn and show absolute intolerance for the foul behavior of [American] black women [and vice versa] which is what said black men in interracial relationships have done and I applaud them for it. Righteous black men must draw a line in the sand and say no more, the time for putting up with contentious acts from black women is over and will no longer be accepted, even minimally. If the truth hurts then you shall be in pain. I will not sit back and allow you or any other black woman to condemn a decent black man for telling the truth and making a venerated stand, becoming the very thing that black women claim black men should be. The nasty and disgusting image and character of American black women should be torn down post haste and I intend to swing the wrecking ball without quarter. If you intend to stand in the way of the demolition then I will put you down with those you would dare foolishly to defend and feel no sorrow for doing so. I champion the ideals and nature of good black women and will not have you associate them with trash to fit your arguments. I am also sick and tired of black women like you dragging the purity of good black women through the mud and into the line of fire to protect the garbage good for nothing black ladies dish out, using virtuous women as shields as they run for cover when exposed. You are most certainly NOT allowed to grab nice black women as hostages to take the fire meant for the wicked ones so that you can throw them all in one category with the reasoning that to condemn one is to condemn all. Your confounded composition of circular arguments belies that you are too simple to produce a valid representation for your annoyances and beliefs to protect the broken image of black women whose practices are nothing short of revolting and detracting. You insist on utterly denying the truths that make up the basis for those things that you complain about so heavily and instead make inappropriate comparisons such as this;

Wasted conjecture. Clearly this is another exaggeration meant to show the improper comparison and stereotyping of black women but ends up showing the insecurity and length with which an American black woman will go through to defend the type of wenches she ought not. If any black woman wants to proclaim black men as any of the above mentioned adjectives and labels so be it, where it isn't true for those certain good black men they will undoubtly move to women who treat them with the honor and respect they are looking for and the qualities they need. So the futile attempt to provide a reverse example of "pigeonholing" falls on deaf ears inasmuch as black women will end up in the exact same place they are now for the exact same reasons that black men continue to list. You cannot simply switch the genders of stereotypes to make an adequate model to refute your issues because there are two different dynamics at work. 1) You are bothered by the truthful accounts made by black men about sorry black women as you see it as stereotyping and so forth and hence try to use reverse stereotypes to get your point across. 2) Black men are not complaining about black women stereotyping them or calling them names rather they're complaining about the way black women act which is a different matter entirely. You can type as many black man stereotypes as pleases you yet it will not phase me one bit because it is not dealing with the true issue instead it is showing your desperate attempt at saving face for black women who have no face left to save.

You can write a book about the bad things and manners of black men and it will not offend me because its true for them and not for me. I do not connect or associate myself with acts and deeds of the wicked just because they are of my race but you do - the empty things are for the empty and the full things are for the full. I am aware that decent black women are in the same pickle as good black men and that they can not afford to wait around filtering through rubbish before they find a man, possibly of another race, that is worthy of them. Once they do I am content and happy for them...that is until they do what you seek to do now which is tossing the good women in with the bad only to afterwards point the finger at black men and say they did it and are unfairly condemning all black women when they speak out against the crooked ones. Its the Doublespeak method peppered with misnomers, double standards, and contradictions made to appear as if all of the above is the fault and tactics of the protagonist.

The truth will not be denied. There are scores of evidence that shows the truth in the complaints of the men on this board. I have a friend who recently had a poor excuse of a black woman try to seduce him. My friend is a wholesome and just man but the woman in question lives her life collecting goverment assistance, smoking marijuana, and drinking beer and alcohol with her numerous ex-boyfriends, lovers, and so called male friends who come and go out her house in droves. If you were to see her driving down the street you'd also see her male entourage crammed in like sardines with her. Later on they'll get together, get high, drunk, and have a sexual romp. Her dress in the neighborhood is that of a two dollar tramp worn to get a sexual rise out of the men which is hardly befitting her three children, two of which are girls. This from a woman in her mid thirties that should know better. And to make matters worse she's trying to seduce a good black man, good black men already being in short supply, to a life of debauchery wherein after he's corrupted he'll be dubbed a dog and so on. Several times she tried an open invitation of sex to him but knowing her background and personality he rejected her. And rightly so, this woman isn't worth the time it takes to have an erection, plus the fact that considering how she allows men to enter her as easily as one would give a handshake her vagina is an insult to a respectable man's penis. Shortly afterwards my friend stopped beating around the bush and ended communication which is exactly what he should have done. She of course caught an attitude and blamed it on him rejecting her for another woman as her pride and ego could not handle the reality that a good man would have nothing to do with her. Perhaps now he may find a woman suitable for the type of man he is. As for the skank woman, she's still doing her thing - lying up with same dogs that give her fleas. But IF my friend later on down the line got involved with a white woman this sorry woman would have nothing but bad things to say when she should be cleaning herself up and turning her life around to better herself. And if that same friend came to this forum and told this story you would label him as bashing women of his own race for white women. Chances are you would be too cowardly to address him individually, parse some of his points, and generalize your arguments to men here accordingly. Stop the denial.

-The Spade-

 

First of all I'd like to say 'Hello' to everyone. Just thought I'd make a post directed to BROWNEYES. Hi browneyes. I take it you were a little upset with my post as well as those of the other brothers. I don't know what you were really expecting to find when you came to this site, but I knew exactly what it was that I was expecting to find when I came here. Yes, I expected to find a forum for people - (Black Men and White Women who are interracially inclined) - where we could express with one another our interests, feelings, joys, frustrations, etc. Some of those things could be from a political standpoint, a social standpoint, hell - any standpoint; For example: what black men dislike about black women, and what white women dislike about white men. But I by no means was trying to diss black women. Hey, when it comes to my views on dating interracially I either keep them to myself or share them with those who can probably relate to me in that way - Thus my reason for taking part in these forums. I don't go up to black women to express my views, and would not seek out a website - such as one which could be entitled 'WHITE MEN/BLACK WOMEN' to express my views. I just can't see myself seeking out a website geared toward - say - WHITE MEN/BLACK WOMEN and posting angry messages on those sites because of my frustration and resentment of what some black women may have posted there concerning their view of black men. No, because that, in my opinion, would definitely be disrepecting balck women. But now - let's say if a black woman came up to me on the street and actively sought me out to see what my opinion was of black women, and I told her, regardless of whether it was what she WANTED to hear or not, would that constitute disrespect for her? You and I both know that it would not. She actively sought out my opinion and should respect my point of view, whether she likes it or not. And the same goes for a black woman who would actively seek out a website for 'Black men/White women' to read what the brothers have posted there.

 

Browneyes,

First of all, welcome to the board. I was initially going to refrain from posting a comment directed toward you as it would seem like Chillbill, myself, and Spade were ganging up on you. That is not my intention. But I am curious. Although this is a free country and you can certainly post opinions on any internet discussion board you choose, why have you chosen this one? Surely you knew what you would find when you came upon this site? Do you find it necessary that you single-handedly defend black womanhood from the tirades of the brothers on this board? Seeing as how you are about to marry a white man (or ARE married to...I can't remember now), why does it matter to you?

Black women have been screaming their old mantra about there being no good black men out there, and we black men have been listening to that garbage, knowing full well that this isn't true. Yet when the tables are turned, when black men stop bending over and taking it from black women, all of a sudden we are being unfair. Puh-leez! It is about time that black women started listening to US for a change. We have needs that are not being met. Because of this, many of us have chosen white women. Now of course there are unscrupulous white women out there. But I can honestly say that in my personal experiences, I have come across more no-good sisters than I have no-good white women.

I agree with you that black men have their faults. I don't believe there is a single brother on this board who would say to you that there aren't any triflin' brothers out there. That being said, as there are enough no-good brothers who ruin it for the good ones, there are enough no-good SISTERS who are ruining for the good ones as well. As comedian Bill Maher once said, some stereotypes are more true than they are false. Although not all black women are loud, obnoxious, unsociable ghetto hootchies, there are enough of them to make one think otherwise.

Well...I am not going to repeat what's already been said by Spade and Chillbill. I just wanted to know why you are here? As Chillbill stated, I would not actively seek out a Black Woman/White Man site. I really don't care why black women choose to date white men. That's their business. They can shout to the rooftops that black men are no good, so they decided to date white. I don't care. I disagree with such a view, but I'm not going to take the time to post my opinions on a BW/WM website.

 

Point taken... and I stand corrected if you didn't get the context in which the initial message was posted. However, when I posted, I didn't post with any intent of being cowardly (which I definitely don't appreciate being called) or trying to defend the honor of women who are nothing short of stupid. At the same time, although (as I already stated in previous posts) your feeling toward the matter is understandably justifiable, (I have already acknowledged the fact that for men such as yourself, you'd have reason enough to feel how you feel) I didn't purposely ignore the fact that yes, I'm MORE than disgusted by the way some bw behave because it makes me look bad right along with them. I can only be responsible for the way I behave; it isn't up to me to be responsible for, nor answer for other bw who are doing Lord knows what. It isn't my job to turn complete strangers of bw into upstanding citizens. Now I do what I can by mentoring 'at-risk' teen girls who feel that getting knocked up, marrying to early, and partying is the way to live. I honestly don't notice very many bm who complain constantly about problems among blacks doing very much to contribute to any resolve. I'm not saying there aren't any, I just don't see that many. I am only accountable to myself, but I don't want to wear a 'one-size-fits-most' that I'm forced to wear, because the brother down the street just had it out with some bw, and refuses to even be cordial to another one ever again after what happened. Just because I forgot to mention this sentiment does not take away from the fact that I have NO sympathy for people who are not worth being bothered with to begin with. My frustration lies in the fact that you can be so condescending when I am merely expressing an idea/thought/opinion/sentiment of the way that I personally view this topic at hand. I thought you were more than glad and willing to chew my head to shreds just for sharing something so simple and non-threatening (or hostile for that matter) as an exchange of words.

For the record, I AM NOT (I REPEAT) I AM NOT DEFENDING STUPID BW. I am speaking regarding the fact that when people state they no longer will date a bw, if they have it made up in their mind that they will not even look at another one, then she can be the most gorgeous, ambitious, good-mannered bw on the face of God's green planet, but if you have multitudes of bm setting it in stone, none of that matters. Even wm don't want stupid bw, nor do ww want stupid bm. I'm just saying that when bm decide to make that a permanent decision, how good the woman is doesn't matter anymore, because he will just see her as being black first before caring to know anything else. I can think of times I personally have run into men like this. I can being doing something so simple as saying hello to be polite, and they will just stand and stare at me like, why are you speaking to me?' while his white or Asian girlfriend starts grabbing onto him (as if I'm trying to take him... :roll: ) Heck, you can throw all the no good ones to whoever wants them. But nowhere did I state that bm should be going out of their way just to date a bw just because she's a bw. If you can find a good ww, aw, or hell, ANY woman whether she's black or not, take her. Why would anyone choose a sorry bm/bw/ww/wm if there's another that's better suited to you just because you have the same race in common? Hell, I didn't.

I have made absolutely NO effort to undermine worthy and noble bw/bm and I don't appreciate being accused of being insecure, in denial, and anything else that has been thrown out at me. I definitely don't like being accused basically, of being another trolling bw who will bend over backwards trying to give every explanation for why bm should have pity for bw who aren't worthy of ANYONE'S time. I will try for future reference not to speak about things in the general sense, as this is not anything NEAR to what I have been trying to express, when my posts were dissected paragraph for paragraph.

The only points I have been TRYING to get across (maybe I didn't do it where it could be understood well enough-it really doesn't require reading very deeply into it) is that some bm will write off bw totally, regardless of how good they are. Maybe you or people you know don't, but it definitely happens, and it isn't a rare occurence. If you look in each forum, you will find a lot of people speaking on everything that is wrong with bw, but not very much is said about problems bm have. There's no denying that bw have problems, but if bm have problems that equally plague them in the community, they aren't making as much noise about it as they choose to do with bw, and not with an equal degree of criticism. This has absolutely nothing to do with being good or bad at that point. If good and well-meaning bm are in equally short supply as bw, then those same decent bw and any other race of women have just as much reason to write off all bm period, the way some bm have done with bw. (AGAIN, THIS IS NOT APPLICABLE TO THOSE WHO ARE NOT DATEABLE)

Those bm who are upstanding are more the exception than the rule. The same applies to bw. At the same time, it doesn't stop a lot of those bm from being so overly critical of bw to where they don't want to acknowledge that bw are in the same boat they're in... but not as many bw are as willing to expand their horizons and date across the borders since bm are doing it increasingly. I honestly don't see the point in decent bw waiting for a bm who doesn't want them anyway (especially when they have made it plain they DO NOT date bw) and being more open-minded about who they date. The ones that tend to approach the decent ones for the most part, never seem to be on the same level, and have absolutely nothing in common. How many uneducated bm or thugs do you know have a clue what the heck fondue is or have even read a James Baldwin novel?

It's bad enough I deal with enough prejudice in the everyday from people who make comments when out with my fiance (from wm, bw, bm, and ESPECIALLY ww) and even with the anonymity of cyberspace, still have to be accused of being cowardly and insecure when I was simply stating what I thought. I have been around bm who had a fit and threw an attitude because I smiled at them and a white girlfriend or a hispanic female. If I were to get nasty, it would be; 'see, that's how bw act,' and if I'm polite, they get upset and go overboard trying to shove their s.o. and flirt with each other in my face, waiting for me to roll my eyes or say something smart. It seems as though I can't win for losing when it comes to the way people expect me to act when I see an interracial couple out together. As for ww, or any woman for that matter, I have a tendency to call people out on stereotyping. Not only should it dispel the idea the notion that bw are only willing to say something when it comes to them, but I've had to come to the defense of more than enough people when it came to people who had attitudes or myths about people from different backgrounds. Is it fair to only speak on issues that pertain only to me, or try to be open-minded enough to see that humans are not monolithic groups of people?

 

Hello again,

To answer any questions, I didn't go out of my way seeking a site like this... I had been here before the new site was implemented. How I INITIALLY got here... it started with one of my girlfriends who was looking around for a place exactly like this one here (she's a ww intrigued with bm) playing on my computer and trying to find every possible interracial website there was on the web (that actually had people discussing real things of importance) and found this one... the rest is history. Before I registered, we would spend afternoons just reading the different things people wrote and on some occasions, someone would say something worth responding to. Now, I'm more softspoken- but I will still let people know what's on my mind. Liz (my friend) decided that she was still undecided about really getting involved with black men, but the only thing holding her back are the closet racist parents (you know, the ones who make it known that they have black friends, yet disapprove of her being romantically linked with a black male :roll: ) Not very many good sites that I've gone to on bw/wm relationships, and I certainly don't fancy the idea of being fetishized by a wm, or anyone for that matter. (which is why I won't look at other sites) BET is really trash now, targeted to black audiences, but it doesn't stop whites or others from watching it either. The same is true for black publications or black urban clothing lines.

Now you asked why I care about this issue to begin with being that I'm involved with a wm... honestly, I think it's the fact I've always gone out of the way with political correctness for the sake of not hurting or offending others in what I do and say. I think it's true that some stereotypes are more true than they are false, but I guess in a more ideal world, people regardless how most others behave, can just be seen as individuals-plain and simple. When it comes to race, how people of certain races differ from each other, and the problems they have, the individual thing just kinda is swept away in the dust... It always becomes, 'those people,' or 'you people' or 'white people', etc...

I appreciate everyone letting me say what I wanted to say, and by all means, if you feel my presence is unnecessary, I will more than gladly leave.

 

I may just be a naive ww with not a lot of exposure to black culture; but do bw actually think this??

 

pacificpeaceful,

Unfortunately, yes!

 

Passion,

That's correct.

That's incorrect. Browneyes is the sole black woman on this board who has put forth views which have been addressed by individual black men here. It is not a war between black women and men though frank and explicit langauge has and will be used to express points but if this is what you deem a war then please step off the battlefield.

That point has been well made by Tonydevine, Chillbill, Zen disciple, and myself in various posts.

That may be because your confusing hatred for members of their own race with the hatred of the actions of people in one's own race.

With all due respect, and I say that out of restraint because I believe you're a new poster, you don't know what you're talking about. I respect your opinion but I don't need you trying to play referee during a conflict that must be had in order to maintain a clear resolution. This is not merely a matter of black men and women blaming each other [although I agree that ego protecting is a part of the problem] and it cannot be simplified as such with all the information presented.

-The Spade-

 

Browneyes

Browneyes wrote:
I appreciate everyone letting me say what I wanted to say, and by all means, if you feel my presence is unnecessary, I will more than gladly leave.

Browneyes,

Don't misunderstand me. I do not want you to think I or anyone else wishes you to leave this board. I just wanted to know why you as a black woman felt it necessary to post here. I use to participate on another board called "Mindkandy's Interracial Relations & Debate" and the battles between the black men and black women on that site made me decide to leave it. It was ridiculous. I could not freely express my views without being attacked. More black women were participating in the BM/WW section than all the BM and WW combined. It seemed they were there to just fire things up. Black women are constantly expressing their frustrations with black men. Why can we not do the same? Many of the black women on that board were like you, they were with white men, but villified black men for choosing white women. I was looking for a site where I could discuss relations between white women and black men (and express my frustrations with black women) without having to constantly defend my choices. I am hoping that this board does not degenerate into the all-out war between black men & women that that other board has become. Its odd that I started this thread with the question: Are white women easy? It has now become all about black men and black women. This is how it starts.

 

Hello. Yeah, it's me again. Hope everyone is in good health and doing well today. I returned to see if there were any more postings here since I made my last post last night. And boy were there. I read them all and it seems that this particular topic in this forum is a really hot one. But I just had to post one more time after reading what was posted here by PASSION. Hello Passion; First let me take time to welcome you to this part of the forum. I read your post and everything you said is well taken. But I think it is CRITICAL that I clarify some things which I feel you may have misunderstood. First - AND FOREMOST - I did not join this site just so I could post what you probably may have taken as mean and hateful messages about black women. No, not at all. I have absolutely no hatred toward anyone, whether it be my own race or yours. And I most certainly have nothing against Browneyes. I welcome her to this forum and I respect her views. I think it's great. And if you read my post you'll see that I never say anything bad about Browneyes or any other black women for that matter. It's not like I'm saying that I feel white women are superior in any way to black women because I don't. How could I say a white woman is superior to my own mother? Passion, I truly feel that you and Browneyes have taken what I and some of the other brothers have said here the wrong way. You see, there's a very big problem existing within the black race between black men and women. Did you notice the question being asked on the homepage of this site? It's a question due to a movie that came out last summer called 'Undercover Brother'. And that's the point I'm trying to get across here. The black race - unlike the white race - is plagued with all kinds of stereotypes. And the sad part is that a lot of those stereotypes have been accepted as (truth) among black people. Yes, white people have never been victimized by racism in this country. But black people have. And I thank God that there were many brave people in the past and today - black men, black women, white men, and white women - who had the courage and fortitude to overcome the ignorance of racism and make this world a better place for all of us to live and get along with one another. As you know during those times in the past many things were frowned upon concerning black and white relations. No using the same bathroom. No drinking from the same water fountain. No eating at the same table. No going to the same schools. No dating outside of one's own race. No this. No that. And it's like we've learned to get over all of them except one. That's right - dating interracially. Yes, the one thing which so many stereotypes are still being born out of and blamed on. I guess that's why it seems so easy for a black man like myself and black women to vent their frustrations and resentments when it comes to this issue. It's because this is the last (so-called TABOO) to deal with when it comes to racism. I say 'so-called taboo' because interracial relations between black men and white women ( and vice versa) have been going on as long as recorded history. Yes Passion, what you were witnessing here WAS NOT self-hatred of any kind. It is simply resentment of anyone excepting the stereotypes presented in many facets of society concerning black men and then using it as a measuring stick to size up why black men may choose to be interracially involved. You yourself Passion - unless you and your husband only go out individually at different times - I'm sure have at least on one occasion been subject to some form of the ignorance of racism due to the fact that you were with a black man. And this coming from other white people is understandable. Stupid - but understandable. But when it comes from black women (and I'm NOT saying ALL black women), then it is not necessarily due to racism but stereotyping. Remember Passion, this part of the forum asked the question, 'Are white women weak/easy when it comes to black men". And this is a fair question and one that's plagued the minds of a lot of black women for years. And of course the only logical answer to that question would have been just to say that some white women are easy, and some black women are easy. Some white women are weak, and some black women are weak. Either I, or Zen, or Spade could have easily just said that and left it there. But this is a forum - you know - like a talk show. Just as if you were watching Jenny Jones or one of those. And as such it's good that we put all our cards on the table and really express the way we feel about the subject of the particular topic at hand. I appreciated your being here as well as Zen, Spade, Browneyes, and anyone else who would like to express his or her opinion concerning the topic of discussion here. Thank you for taking the time to read my reply to your post and hope to continue hearing from you and everyone else. Stay well.

 

I know EXACTLY what you're talking about (@Zen) regarding Mindkandy's site... I've been to that site before, and the way every single topic was geared to something where race was always part of it got on my LAST nerve... :roll: Is it ever possible to discuss something meaningful without race always having to be the center of discussion? I have seen exactly what you were talking about with some of the bw who would date wm and trash bm in the process, while acting as though they couldn't give a frog's green butt that bm no longer wanted anything to do with them. Now if I were REALLY trying to villify bm who dated ww, I wouldn't be so stupid as to put myself in a position of having NO credibility by dating a wm. :roll: Then, I'd proceed to call every bm on this board a conceited, self-righteous self-hating bastard who hates his mama or whatever those other things they say are... All I really did was state my own observations about the matter, but have found no point in condemning and name-calling a bm because of who he dates to make a point. I have already acknowledged that bm have the right to feel the way they do, just as bw. If it's good for the goose, why not for the gander? Black people in general, however, have REALLY got to get a handle on this whole 'at-each-other's-throat' thing, because we seem to have the worst race relations amongst ourselves than anybody. But where does the civility start? I can't even go to the gym anymore, without someone- whether a bw or bm I know make a comment regarding my being a sellout because they know my fiance. It's a damn shame when black people can't even be CIVIL to one another. :evil: Then again, anytime ANY black person crosses the color line, whether they continue within the race or not, you still get called a sellout which is what bothers me. I have never found the need to give a mile long list of every reason why I won't ever date a bm ever again to date a wm, or even a hm.

 

I see your point, Browneyes. I must admit I have been guilty of blasting black women for their "misgivings" and using them to justify my choice to date only white women, when the reality is, my choice to date white women has nothing at all to do with black women. I just happen to find white women very attractive. All things being equal, I would probably choose a white woman over a black woman, an hispanic woman, an asian woman, etc. That's just my personal preference. I just get tired of having to defend my choices to people, particularly black women. I understand the socio-political connotations that my choice presents, but to me, skin color is no different than height, weight, eye color, hair color, or any other physical trait. Some men love women with large breasts. Some me like women with long legs. I just happen to like women who have lighter skin than mine.

Oh well, I digress. I hope you decide to stay on this board. Don't ever think I would want you to leave because I may disagree with you. As far as I am concerned, you are welcomed here.

 

Browneyes,

We've been down this road plenty of times before but I think I've been going about this all wrong. I'm beginning to suspect that you may have at one time or another been what the men here have written about and possibly even been rejected by black men in the past for similar reasons which is why you can't let this go. As a matter of fact on the topic "Have You Given Up on Black Women" I said, and mark my words, that:

Before the transition to this new forum I confronted Harmony, on the old board and exposed her as being precisely what black men complained about. Among other things she claimed that she had been to hell and back with black men, that she was the ideal woman for men that stole from her, cheated on her, and beat her. She warned white women on the site not to believe that they would be treated any better. Harmony didn't tell them that she was the very type of black woman that black men and myself have talked about much before. The kind that is attracted to thugs and willing to endure all kinds of harships for them, passing over good men because they are not her type, and when at last she comes to her senses and moves on she gets resentful of the same type of black men she passed over before, who have found love in the arms of a white woman and treat them better then she ever was with the thugs she loved. So she settled down on the whitewomenblackmen.com board and become a passive disturbance using her relationship with a white man as leverage to help get away with it. Until I set the record straight.

Bluesbaby was a former poster who was more aggressive in her exaggerations to what she referred to as blackwomen being stereotyped and how tired she was of hearing them used by black men who were with white women. She too used her relationship with a white man as leverage. She, like yourself, condemned or accused black men on the board in general, NEVER IN SPECIFIC until my constant prompting, and stereotyped the men on the board with double standards and contradictions. No matter how many truths and facts were given she overlooked them in her emotinal haze. Why? Because she fit some of the very stereotypes she claimed she was so tired of. Chances are, though she would deny it, some black men probably didn't give her the time of day because of her attitude and conduct hence her unreasonalbe emotionalism when the issue came up. By virtue of her posts I picked up on her dormant contentious attitude, the same funky attitude she claimed was a stereotype. Also she was fat, no, obese, of which is claimed is an unjust stereotype (like yourself) for black women but isn't for those with whom it applies like herself. Had to set the record straight for that one too.

Then there's you, the third of the three. It was sitting in front of me the whole time but I was looking at it the wrong way. But when you said this it hit me:

The reason you were so stung was because the truth that was written, although frank, applied to some previous experience of yours, and experience that stung because it was so true. It may not have been your intention in coming here but it has become the problem now. You, like the other two black women, are so aggravated with the sentiments of those black men on this forum because it either applies or has applied to you personally. Your disagreement is passive but creates the same disturbance, it is so devoid of reason and so full of emotion that you are either unaware of how you're putting your foot in your mouth or aware but in denial or both. Regardless it shows a connection that is not skin deep. You say:

But you have. You have done precisely what you claim you do not do which is a halmark trait of the guilt black women show when they come on this board doing the exact same thing. I accuse you of exactly what you are guilty of. And I can prove it with your very words but that shouldn't be needed because this is a board for white women and black men not a soapbox for black women. Neither will it become so!

-The Spade-

 

Passion,

And so was I.

And I stand by my statement that if you deem our discussion to be a war then please step off the battlefield. Or better yet, don't step on.

Yes, and did you understand what they meant when they said they hate black women....many times over? As I alluded to before, black men will talk about their hatred for black women not in the context that they hate them because they're black women but because of the actions that black women perform. The two must not be confused.

Actually its quite simple, you'd either get told or you'd get gone. Or both and that's enough for me.

If you think I have keep trying to press my buttons by reminding me and see what happens.

-The Spade-