What's wrong with American Men?

Continued at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/christelyn-karazin/modernday-marriage-would-_b_1031450.html

 

It's an interesting opinion piece but it's unfair to paint all men in America with that brush.

But I have certainly felt the way that Tanisha (mentioned in the post) did with her husband who was simply another child for which to care. I was exhausted when I was married, I worked twice as much as he did, took care of the acreage and the dog and did all the work around the house. The only thing he seemed able to do was go to work and play - likely I simply enabled that behaviour learned from his stay at home mom.

Women are finally stepping up to the plate on the work and education front, so it's time the men stepped up to the plate in arenas previously dominated by women and became equal partners in every way (for those of us who want that style of relationship).

 

i can see a nice little argument happening in this thread later lol

 

LOL, Gender swipes and all...

There is no such thing as parity, these men who are deferring are merely playing their position; competition has winners, not equals.

 

ahh man its gonna get live. good thread mikey. have to spread around before I give you another good rep

 

Good point.

 

Ya dig

 

From my experience men usually do step up to the plate I never really see instances where that doesn't happen and if it has its because it had always been that way and the women want an immediate change once they work too.
Probably situations like that could be avoided with more communication.

 

This is the thing that is sooooooo annoying about the cultural conservatives. Women aren't allowed to be strong without that strength coming at the expense of men. I'm not threatened by a man with an education, a brain, and a backbone - indeed, he sounds to me like the perfect guy! Why is it so threatening to the right when women have those same things?

 

So true DK.

 

I like the idea, the phrase you call cultural conservatives. The idea of rigidity, or inflexibility to change. The idea that could expand to mean most conservatives want to protect the status quo, and are always reluctant to change without a fight.

What is interesting is that they are blind-sighted to the very ideals they defend : individual responsibility and "deregulation". It has nothing to do with gender but the human ideals, they profess. Yet they can't see that men are doing pretty badly in post-industrial economy, and need new set of skills, amongst which is subtle skills that fit more within a service economy.

Times are changing, I suspect. It would take a generation to really assess this trend in history. The world as we know it is being redefined around us, daily. The idealized roles of women are no longer feasible for the times, methinks.

 

Women out earning men in salary?!? Say what!? But according to the feminists on this board, that just isn't true

 

Men live to oppress women. Didn't you get the memo?

 

Actually, it isn't.

http://www.pay-equity.org/

 

I would love to see their payroll because I just don't buy it.
When people interview for a position a managers job is to negotiate for the salary they can give that saves the company money. I really doubt that when a man walks in they want to give him more because he's a man. They want to save on employees period. I also think these are averages not accounting for the fact many profession women leave work to pursue family or at the very least pregnancy. That takes away from possible earning time.

 

If you read what I posted, you'll see that it's for year-round employees, so pregnancy doesn't account for the gap.

I'd bet good money that you'd buy into the proposition that subtle biases favor white people over black people and in much the same way, subtle biases operate to favor men over women when it comes to things like salary. In the case of gender, many women are also socialized to devalue themselves. I can't tell you how many times a genuinely bright young woman has approached me about a paper topic or some idea that she has about assigned readings only to begin some really great thought with an apology. I work to break that habit when I can, but many women are unwilling to ask for what they deserve, including a higher salary....

[YOUTUBE]n6AFuOStXGQ[/YOUTUBE]

 

You know, they really aren't. They're both forms of prejudice, and they both suck.

 

One I've experienced and the other I've never seen in my life. In my current job the former CEO is a woman the CFO is a woman the head of HR is a woman up until my director was a woman. In undergrad I had mostly female professors. All the females I grew up with have had a much easier time finding empoyment opposed to the males. I just don't see it. Outside of this forum women in my life have never commented on it. I'm not saying it doesn't exist but it doesn't seem as visible.

 

Ok, but have you been looking for it with the same level of awareness that you've been looking for racism? I will admit that I don't always "see" the stuff that the men on here talk about having experienced until it's pointed out to me.

I'm curious about the size of your company.... do women make up 50% of the C-level executives? And I would suggest that it's not just finding employment. As the pay equity stuff suggests, it's also the terms on which one's employed. Are women paid and promoted on the same basis as their male counterparts?