The Double Standard

Man meets woman. Man is smitten by said woman. Man has his own standards and criteria that he looks for in a woman. Ditto for the woman. Man makes overture to woman but is told by same "You can be my friend but that is it!" Woman won't relent and lower her standards by dating someone who doesn't meet her expectations (and why should she ?) However, it is tacitly understood by both parties that said male is suppose to lower his standards to meet hers by agreeing to remain strictly a platonic friend with a very rigid boundary which he does not cross (a sort of no-man's land). Women have been pulling this off since Adam and Eve.

This is B.S situation is due to the fact that when a man encounters a woman on a date, he sits across the table with all her anger at men aimed at him. She will attempt to recognize him as the good man, but he must fail because he is single, and no good men are single. From there the process consists of finding the specific ways this particular man is a bad man. Once she completes the identification he is dismissed, and she returns to the flock of other women to report her findings.

Women have all the power. THEY decide. THEY choose. THEY select the men to go out with. THEY accept and keep the gifts. THEY decide when – sorry, if – they'll sleep with you. And who is it that demands equal rights ?

 

For sure they do, who else should?

They decide. for sure I decide with who I spend my time- it´s my time
THEY choose. yes, I also choose, who I like
THEY select the men to go out with. yes, do you expect that anybody else should do that for me?
THEY accept and keep the gifts. if you don´t want to make a gift , why do you give it?
THEY decide when – sorry, if – they'll sleep with you.Yes, it´s my body


Excuse me all, what you mentioned you can do by yourself, too. We are free human beings- you sound as if everybody on the street, wherever I am should have the power to command about me..

 

Stopped reading there.

If a man does not meet one specific woman's criteria, then she is simply not the woman for him.

One of my personal criteria is that she likes me, too.

Where's the double standard

Raocha, did I get fooled by the thread title again?

 

I'm sorry, but I have to tell you that you're coming across as Bitter you might want to do something about that, I personally find that, as do other women extremely unattractive.

 

My first thoughts are to agree with Francie, you’re bitter and you need to get laid. But this particular subject has been a topic of discussion in multiple threads recently and it’s a little surprising to me to find quite a few men who believe this.

I don’t grasp how agreeing to remain platonic friends is indicative of the man lowering his standards. That would seem to imply that one of your standards is that all women have to be more than platonic with you… which is not only ludicrous but highly unlikely to occur. Perhaps it speaks more to a belief that you’re entitled to whatever you want, regardless of whether the other person is similarly inclined? No one is entitled to anything, especially with respect to other people.

Oh and using Adam and Eve as an example is equally ludicrous. They were a couple, they had children, rather obviously Eve didn’t tell Adam she just wanted to be platonic friends.

If this is the type of woman you are trying to date, it’s no wonder you aren’t having better luck. I don’t dispute that there are some women who will judge you according to the other members of your gender that they feel have wronged them in some way. There are men who do that to women as well, and in fact that’s what you’re doing here by suggesting all women are like the ones you have met. That’s simply not the case. Some people are actually capable of objectivity when it comes to interpersonal relationships, we don’t hold anyone accountable for anything other than what that individual says or does, and we don’t enter into every conversation with preconceived notions. But with your attitude, you are unlikely to find someone like that, and less likely to recognize them if you do because you have already written all women off.

The assertion that no good men are single is not only false, it’s rude to the men who happen to be single. Being single in no way implies you aren’t desirable. Not everyone is in a race to attach themselves to someone. Some people enjoy being single, some don’t want to be attached, some like dating lots of different people. Marriage isn’t the Holy Grail to everyone. Frankly I applaud people who are smart enough to remain single, rather than settle.

Women seeking equal rights, has nothing to do with dating. You are taking a major concept and applying it to something far more minor. But if you want to do that then I look at it this way: men have always had the right to decide who they want to go out with, decide who they want to approach, decide who they want to give to or accept gifts from, decide who they want to sleep with and when. Women have those exact same rights. So really this isn’t about a double standard, the standard is the same as both men and women have that power. The issue is that women sometimes choose not to do any of those things, and more specifically that they choose not to do them with YOU. Now that is the crux of the matter, and the only person who can change that is YOU. If you consistently run into women who only consider you platonic friend material, then perhaps there is a reason, but it would appear that the only thing those women have in common is their reaction to you so one can only conclude that you are the one constant and therefore you should ask yourself why. Francie is also correct that an attitude like yours isn’t attractive, so perhaps you should start there?

You know you remind me of someone else from the UK who is a member, but hasn't been around lately. I wonder...

 

TOTALLY agree with you - like that man is mindless and have no choice in the subject?
meh - dude is bitter.

 

It just goes to show that men have absolutely no redress for our anger. Women’s crimes against us go unpunished. A man who complains about this system is written off as bitter and rejected. If he opens up his true feelings, as we are SUPPOSED to do and what you women tell us to do, then he is punished for it if the truth is not what she wants to hear. I think the reason you responded to my post is because you are terrified that I am UNCOMFORTABLY accurate about you.

You want to maintain the current situation where a man must go cap in hand to a woman asking for favours, while you are free to reject him with no more hesitation than brushing away a street beggar. So let me get this straight : Women can enjoy the benefits of dating (dinners, nights out, etc.), without ever having to reciprocate (Have sex). So there is absolutely NO regard to the negative effect this has on men - having their time wasted, having to give a woman the pleasure of their company for free. It boils down to the simple fact that women are allowed to get away with PIMPING the men for their personality and time and get nothing in return. Listen - Here is what it feels like for men this current environment. Imagine waking up tomorrow to find that rape is now legal. And then every man you told this to just very smugly and condescendingly says “Hey… not all men rape” or “Your just bitter” It may be constructive to point out that only bigots and tyrants are afraid of having the truth expressed to them.

And never once will I say than men don't suck, too. Only difference is in our society, the "Men Suck" attitude is so deeply embedded into the culture, we accept it as truth without even thinking about it. When someone says that women suck... well, that forces you to think a little bit, dunnit ? Sure, men can be deceitful, but there is a difference. Men are mostly only liars during competition, such as in the business world, or with enemies. Women, on the other hand, are liars and back stabbers with their own friends !! Also I find it funny the way Espy says I need to get laid, rather than saying I need to get a a girlfriend ? Could it be that she knows that's pretty much all she has to offer a man ?

 

Actually, he reminds me of another incredibly bitter poster from the UK that was here when I first joined the forum who argued that men should be able to rape women who don't agree to sleep with them and that society should be more sympathetic to men who need to sexuality assault women in order to get laid or some such nonsense. I don't know if this is the same guy, but I remember the rape advocate going on the exact same rant about constantly ending up as a platonic friend and women having all the power.

 

I thought the exact same thing. Great minds think alike.

 

So are you a 'John' or a male prostitute? First, you think that paying for a date means you should get sex. Then, you think that a woman shouldn't get to spend time with you for free. I don't know which side of the coin you are on. :smt017

 

You clearly don't want a girlfriend. You are rather obviously focused on sex, hence the suggestion. What's disturbing is how militantly you appear to pursue this 'I'm entitled' line of thinking. You're not entitled, get over it, move on. You'll be better off once you realize that regardless of how highly you think of yourself, you are no better than anyone else.

 

Do you understand, what you say just in that few sentences?

You insult.. and you expect that you can have for your small pocket money you gave out for a dinner that you have the right for sex? Are you crazy? Do you think all women are bitches? Better you go to a red light etablissement, they are going to tell you exactly and very detailed, what you can have for which amount..

End of story...not to believe!

Good girl!

 

The tone of your posts does come across as very bitter. I am having a hard time figuring out why you are complaining here, nobody is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to ask women out. If you are concerned about the time, money, expense of dating/getting to know a woman, there is a real simple way to fix this. Simply ask a woman you are interested in to meet for coffee or a drink, or a walk in the park, that way, expense is kept to a mere minimum/zero on the first date when you are both figuring out if you would like to spend more time together.

You are doing the asking out, so *you* have the opportunity to set the plans. Of course a woman should not feel obligated to have sex, just because a man *willingly* pays for an expensive date, in the hopes that she will, that is his fault, not hers. If you are so concerned about wasting your time and money, do a better job screening your dates up front.

Lastly, if you have a genuine interest in dating and getting to know the woman, having sex as soon as possible should not be your primary focus.

 

I had a good old chuckle about this, you know what, you might be accurate about me, yeah i've been for dinner with guys and not felt inclined to have sex with them because of that, I don't really care if some muppet like you has issues about women bestowing sex upon you, that's not my problem nor is it anyone elses, i'm looking after my own interests like many other Boys/Men Girls/Women do I feel bad about that? No I bloody don't, lifes to short for me to wile away the hours feeling guilty about a bit of dinner I ate and didn't pay for with sex!

I think the part I underlined reflects more on you and not Espy, I should imagine she said get laid because you certainly don't seem of sound enough mind to go the whole hog and maintain a relationship! I know for certain that's what I'm thinking. :smt063

 

Don't feed the middle-aged virgin troll.

 

I'm slapping my own wrists as I type.

 

He sounds like this guy:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...u1hfkJ&usg=AFQjCNEdXRXkI-CPDumufSG2ie1eHyxvTQ


But yeah, he's obviously a troll.

 

I'm not really focused on sex, YOU ARE and you, like all women will NEVER give up your sexual power which is based on the laws of supply and demand. By keeping the supply of sex low and the demand high, women can write their own ticket because this is the one place where women do hold power and you have seen to it that the process of men trying to get sex from women is as difficult as possible. Hence the game is one were women assume that men are the BIG BAD ENEMY who have to be outplayed and outsmarted and every man that approaches you...you think its one BIG conspiracy.

Secondly you talked about when a woman "Friendzones" a man because she is not into him so she gives him the "Let's Just Be Friends" line and then you asked me. "What's wrong with that ?" NOTHING if she F**ING meant what she said. You see, women don't want ANYONE to not like them. You are all so afraid of hurting a guy's feelings that you will tell him "Let's Just Be Friends" instead of a straight rejection, EVEN if you have no intention of being friends with him. Just to avoid looking like a mean B I T C H. You don't really mean your "Let's Be Friends" line, what you REALLY mean is, "I don't want to hang out with you...please don't hate me for that" So tell me : Why can't women be honest ? Because she's protecting a guys feelings ? You wanna know something ? A woman who rejects a man politely with the "Let's just be Friends" line is doing more damage than if she is stuck-up to him because he thinks he can reverse the rejection because he got close. "If she was so polite, she must like me somewhat and she needs a little more convincing" that's his train of thought. I ask you again - Why can't woman be honest when rejecting a guy ? Because we might think badly of you. Listen - I don't think it's possible for me to think any worse than I already do of women.

So it's established that women LOVE male friends. Men don't have female friends. Men just have women they have not F**ked yet. However why is it that women seem to have male friends ? I think the truth is two fold. Women like male friends of two kind.

1) THE CUDDLE B I T C H

This is a guy who never gets to F U C K the woman but gets to have intimate moments with her like cuddling, spooning, or otherwise being affectionate. NOTE : That the guy DOES NOT get to engage in ANY kind of sexual relations with the girl. The girl merely uses him to fulfill a lack of intimacy in her relationship with her bf. Basically this is just a guy who has a very high position on her friends ladder. So far up the friends ladder that he gets the dubious honor of getting to provide all the intimacy that a girl is missing when she's off F**King guys who basically don't care about her. The F**K buddy is cuddle bitches arch enemy, because he is EVERYTHING the cuddle bitch wants to be but will never be.


2) THE INTELLECTUAL WHORE

This is me, on many occasions, if you read Woody Allens story ‘The Whore of Mensa’ where he talks about the rise of Intellectual W H O R E S because he was one growing up and I think most men have been a woman’s IW at some point. These are men who women keep around for intellectual reasons, like good conversation, solid logic, good at fixing things but she won’t F U C K him.

To the guys who understand where I'm coming from, one thing I will say is, no matter how much rejection, humiliation you face from women. NEVER LOWER YOUR STANDARDS. Ugly girls are just as snooty and arrogant as good looking ones. You may as well get rejected by a decent looking girl, because there is really nothing like asking out a girl you'd have to close your eyes to F**K and hearing she doesn't have time for you. When girls say "Maybe you should go for a plain girl" or "Ugly girl" Don't f**king listen to them !!! Stop listening to whatever they have to say !!! and just walk away. Because they're f**king LYING!! IT'S NOT TRUE !!! UGLY GIRLS ARE NOT LESS PICKY!!!

Guys, just think if there was some way to encapsulate pain and make a weapon out of it. So you could track down all the women who rejected you and who were F**king lucky you even spoke to them, but because of some delusional society ingrained idea of them being special, they simply brushed you off like an ant, and you could just fire that weapon on them and all that intensified humiliation and self-degradation could just beam right into their soul and stay there and it would take years or a F**king lifetime for that injury to heal over.

Finally Espy - To be honest, I'm starting to think that if it wasn't for the possibility of men having sex with women, half of all men wouldn't even bother talking to women much less put-up with all the crap that women like you, dish-out. What, you really think men endure your S**T because you're such a brilliant conversationalist and awesome companion ? I've COMPLETELY lost interest in women, and I've stopped trying and caring. Since then I've devoted myself to literature, art, sports, music, and my career.

 

Crazy talk.

I find it offensive that you demean equal rights by suggesting it is invalidated by women choosing whether or not to sleep with you. My right to work, to be educated, to vote, to own property -- none of this has a damned thing to do with your dating life, and how dare you suggest that women are less deserving of our rights simply because you can't find anyone to sleep with.

You, sir, are a creepazoid.