No more than a Mr Miyagi or a Yoda. He was a teacher and a mentor. The magic negro in that series would have been the Oracle not Morpheus. Usually you don't have scenes where the magical negro beats the white character and has dope action sequences of his own independent of the main character. He was a supporting character yes but doesn't fit your Magical Negro trope.
If you say so. I don't see how he's more acceptable than Finn, especially since he himself was captured and tortured by Smith in the first movie. But somehow Finn should have been on"Neo" level shit for Star Wars in his first outing......
Where are you getting that from? I never said anything close to that. I just wanted a stronger a character. And Morpheus got caught after getting beat by Agent Smith and then beaten by a bunch of cops. Its not even in the same league as that wack ass fight with Finn. Like I said before nothing about him resembled an intergalatic bad ass soldier.
And where was it anywhere put that Finn was supposed to be "an intergalactic bad ass soldier"? That's like automatically expecting anyone with military service of any kind to be a "bad ass soldier". They even put it out there that particular village raid was his first actual combat mission, being that he had been maintenance before that. Assuming we don't find out that he may be Force sensitive himself in the next two movies, that might have been why he broke his conditioning.
You should just give it up. You can give him example after example after example and he'll still stubbornly stick to his opinion. It's not worth it. Btw, everything you're saying (as well as a few others) is correct and makes perfect sense.
https://youtu.be/3gvbTWGJgPA Let's end the acrimony with a clip of Daisy Ridley kissing a random black dude in some fashion video. It occurs at 0:44.
The idea of Finn as a "badass" soldier was established in one of the prequel novels. In the book it says he beat several of his fellow troopers in sparring combat, and it also says he is a natural leader who was on a fast track for advancement in the First Order. There is even a quote were Captain Phasma says "[Finn] has the potential to be one of the finest stormtroopers I have ever seen."
This is going to be a long one. Finn was fighting someone who was trained to use that weapon(whatever that weapon is called). He had no training with a light saber. It was clearly an unfair fight. You will not find a match in the last 6 movies of a newbie fighting a non clone storm trooper that was trained with his weapon of choice. You are right it never happened because not a single person in the movies are given a light saber for the first time and told go at it. Luke was trained. Anakin was trained. Finn was thrown into a situation that was unfair and manage to do his best. I understand that he is in the books but I really don't think they took that into consideration when making the movie. Even if they did, all the storm troopers get the same training(or I think they do). From what I see online, Finn has no field combat experience just practice. So he has a weapon that he was not trained with and no field combat experience against someone who was chosen to be in the field over sanitation. He shouldn't have won. For all we know this is someone on the level of Rex fighting a newbie in real field combat. I don't recall Luke fighting someone with a lightsaber in the first movie. I don't recall Anakin fighting anyone before training with a light saber. The killing of his father, I felt pacified the fight between good and evil internally. Again, I am just pointing out the unfairness of a fight for Finn. I don't know if he has force abilities or not but to damage to someone with some training shows potential. I will admit that running from a military that is trying to kill you is self serving. I mean does anyone think that he should have stayed and fought the whole military there? The other point is stereotypical hero saving the damsel in distress. He didn't have to do anything. He could have exited. Why risk your neck for a girl that you barely know? You are right they needed a ship.
He was in the books And if you watched the Clone Wars you see the training they went through and they were elite soldiers. Its not like there's no bases.
Going through training and field experience are two different things. You can't think that a new clone would be able to take on Rex never mind ashoka..... Mind you, Finn is not a clone trooper. Being ranked high in training and being ranked high in field experience are two different things.
I totally agree with but there was nothing to exhibit he had any kind of training at all. There was absolutely no cool factor to this kid.
Well he was facing very talented people. The cool factor is subject to opinion. Out of the three newbies, I'd say he was the more memorable one due to the charisma. Poe was probably seen as the more cooler of the three but was totally misused. Rey was too cold for me to get into.
Put it like this if we were kids I doubt anyone would be buying his action figure and when little kids play pretend no one is gonna want to be Finn
First off, I don't think bringing in the books is really a fair way of arguing this. Most of the audience only has the movies to go off of. And, if the director, producers and editor of the film put the movie together in such a way that omited most, or all, of the traits that would have made Finn an actual bad ass hero (like all the other past main white male protagonists in the SW films), then that alone says a ton about the missed opportunity that was the character of Finn. For that reason, hearing how much of a bad ass he was in the book made his dipiction on screen seem that much more neutered. Kind of like Tyrese from TWD comic vs. Tyrese from TWD TV show. One was a compatent warrior against the unxead hordes. The other was a great baby sitter. Seems like they sacrificed him to make her more heroic. It was never like that in A New Hope. Luke, Han, Lea and Ben all got a chance to shine. There was no promise of, "Oh, in the next movie, he or she will get to be more heroic." It was laid out in their first outing. Great story telling. Finn is the kind of black character you'd have expected to see back in the late 80's or 90's. Not the kind we were led (by the trailers) to expect to see today. TDK is making some valid points.
Good point and well said Its like him just being in the film and not going full blown Jar Jar is enough for people Great comparison with Tyrese too. They did redeem themselves with Morgan but can't stand his decisions but thats for another thread lol
Then that should have been established ON SCREEN. Not everyone who enjoys the Star Wars movies is automatically going to delve into other Star Wars related media outside of the movies. Especially non hardcore Star Wars fans who don't soak up every possible details about the mythology and especially if it establishes important things about the characters off screen that should be known when you watch the movies going forward.
This dialogue has become excessively tedious. Yes, Finn could've been more "bad ass," perhaps he shouldn't have run from Rey's attack when they first met or taken out some of the storm troopers with greater ease and aplomb. But from a writing standpoint, his foibles with the lightsaber against the storm trooper were a set up for his use of the lightsaber against Kylo Ren; also, his combat skittishness could be the expression of him being a conscientious objector, which was the grounding of his decision to not kill on order--this is supremely heroic and easily the most commendable kind of bravery. This is a matter of taste and opinion. Without being privy to his story arc, we can't properly evaluate his character. His strong connection to Rey and Kylo Ren (Ren looked directly at him when he decided not to kill) have to be fleshed out. This is only the first act, which is an introduction to the main players and central conflict.
