i guess i just always looked at it from the standpoint of "i haven't done anything to you...i'm minding my own business, so why do you have to hate on me?" throughout my life, i've always had close relationships with people of other/all races...i love people. i don't really give a crap about the color of your skin. so, when i see black women or ANYBODY for that matter, judging me and pointing fingers at me b/c i'm a white woman involved with a black man - it pisses me off. i can't help that i'm white anymore than those women can help that they are black. I really feel the same way especially about the part above.
True, there needs to be a meeting in the middle. And I dont think bw's problems are with you and/or the bm as much as its just a feeling of rejection they are feeling about themselves. So I wouldnt classify their feelings as racism. Now they may make some racist remarks, which they shouldnt and I would never condone, but nonetheless, their feelings are a response to racism. (Racism comes from a position of power.) I guess what this thread really needs is a bw's voice to shed some light from the other perspective. (And s-chic, although my apology was quite sincere, the "rep" comments were tongue-in-cheek. No apology necessary on your part.)
the bolded part summed it all up. that's a very powerful statement - i need to just ponder on that for awhile, b/c i know so many people for whom i could apply that. thanks! :wink:
@jellybird, From what I can discern most of the problems between bw and ww have roots in other areas...mainly the workplace. Just like Shaft has outlined his problems in finding employment the racial dynamics extend beyond the workplace for ww and bw. Also some ww can't understand why bw do not worship them the same as bm so they are often disappointed particularly if they are the type who feel they're doing blacks a favor by gracing them with their presence. Some ww do relish the idea that they are hurting bw and the black race...some bm feel the same. I know some IR couple feel upset when they do not garner the proper attention/hatred from bw so they actively seek and provoke situations too.
I just posted to this to another thread but maybe should have posted it here instead: I've been thinking about black women a lot. Been getting some flack from a few and rather than get mad I'm trying to get understanding. This is what I've come up with so far: Black women are afraid. And because they're afraid, they're acting out in anger. They're afraid of not having enough to survive, they're afraid of the prejudice, they're afraid that they won't be able to handle what life throws them. And the only other people who they feel understand them - black men - are leaving them. For the enemy. Society tells black women that they are not worthy - their hair is not pretty enough, their features are not pretty enough - and so if the black men leave them, who will be there? Who can they rely on? Of course, a frequent complaint from black men is that BW are very aggressive and bitchy. I think BW have this aggression because 1) of fear and 2) bc they feel it's necessary to get anywhere and anything in life. Only, they don't know when to turn it off. A mother teaches it to her daughters, and on and on. It's a very selfish thing, to be aggressive all the time, but if you're afraid, it's natural to want to protect yourself. Only, that shield can burn you if you hold it too close. I don't know, what do you think? No BW will speak candidly with me about this and I really want to understand their feelings, where they're coming from.
As a white woman, I certainly can't tell you how black women feel, but I can draw some insight from the woman in my man's life. My boyfriend and I were both in long term marraiges. He is a college educated lawyer. His sister who is a friend and co-worker of mine introduced us 2 years ago, we formed a friendship that turned to a relationship in March. She knows us and is happy for us. Normally, she feels that black men should not look out of their race, but likes us as individuals and as a couple. His mom always encouraged him to date from within his community. "In fact right when we started dating, she asked why he had very dated a white woman, he told her that now he is. We meet a couple weeks ago, and she was fine. His ex-wife knows that we are dating. She found out via the grapevine and is not okay with it. She feels a white woman cant raise black children. So right now, he spends most of the time with the kids without me, which is fine, as I feelregardless, with divorce that introducing a new mate to the kids needs time and caution. However, I have spent time with them when at families events and his ex-wife is okay with that.
I can tell you from my experience alot of black women have esteem issues. Certainly where it comes from as a direct causation as racism being the case I disagree with my sociologist friends that it is historical discrimination and racism, or media. I remember while in college, I met this great young lady. She was black. And we had a great time together for about 9 months. And at first I would always see her around campus, I thought she was a student. Turns out she was not and just worked on campus. Either of which did not matter to me, I was into her for her. She had said to me that "Brotha's like me don't usually go for sisters". Of course I had to ask...The hell are you talking about? She said because here you are in college, all these white women, don't think they don't see your potential. And I said well what about you? You're a young black man in college, graduating in about a year, you have no children, you speak proper, you dress like a white boy.....you're marked for them. Who is them? White women she replied. With a brotha like you they have the brains, the defiance to mommy/daddy, the mystique of your blackness. My jaw dropped instantly when she said all this to me. She even her mother had asked her..."Why is he talking to you"?. The sheer continuous feeding of it from one generation to the next is staggering to say in the least. And she broke it off with me, out of fear she would not be able to keep me satisfied and interested. I've never dated any race exclusively, just those who found me attractive. The more I think about her, the more I think that lack of confidence for men too is a turn off.
The same can be said for alot of white men also For many white men,being cheated on with a Black guy really makes their insecurities go into overdrive
Oh my, I did not expect that results to the question, which one was the "bad" doll. :-( so sad. But I experiences similiar stuff here. I talked to some westafrican men and they all had the opinion, that it brings you luck to get light kids or in general, that it is better to have rather a brown than a deep black skin. When I told them that their skin was beautiful they told me, mine was. When I asked them again why a lighter child would be prefered, they only repeated, that it gives luck to the family. Did you read about albino muder in Kenya btw? than they asked me, why would I think my (very pale) skin was not prettier than theirs and I told them, that I think white skin on me looks unhealthy and like a dead fish´s belly- I exaggerated of course, I like my skin, but I was so shocked by what they just said. Every one laughed about the fish thing and topic was over. I know that in southasia as well they use cosmetics, that bleach the skin. When I went there for volunteering, some girls always wore long shirts, even at 40° Celsius, because they were afraid to tan. The man I actually secretly like is the blackest of all my black acquaintances. ^^
Some people on God's Own Earth just can't get *beyond* the factor of race/ethnicity/colour and such... Damn. OpinionsCartoonStudios@Yahoo.Co.UK
i love the White Trash comments they say, because i dont know what they are talkign about when they use that. If the BW is from a poor or working class background and remains that class why is she talking about a WW and her class? trash is trash, it was meant to be an insult to poor and working class white women--but unless the BW is wealthy or solidly Middle class, she can be considered trash as well.
Co-sign! This is why I NO LONGER buy into the garbage (competing) BW feed to justify their hate or jealousy. (Mothers who complain get a pass because naturally, they may want their sons to marry a good black woman like them, as might an Italian, or Jewish mom, and it's strictly emotional.) But to get all riled up over a STRANGER or celebrity and their mate choices? Especially if you already have a man (though I suspect the most bitter bloggers are single, even if they pretend they aren't and are just 'commenting') From the moment they are born, Black men in particular are told what to do, how to act and behave, now it's who to love? GTHO...mind your damn business. I don't hear a peep when its a WM leaving a WW for a BW - no wait - yes I do, its praising the union and how the man picked a better choice, blah blah! If a resentful Black man ever tries to remind the sista about the slave masters, it's retorted that Black men are jealous and want so bad to be white and have the white mans power, and THIS is why they fuck WW, to get back at whitey. At what point does this redundant nonsense stop? I mean, does the Black 'cultural' mindset truly think so monolithic? That when a Black woman makes a snide racial (aka "coon/sellout") remark over a bm/ww union, well then, it's definitely about race and the beauty 'ideal'? Frankly, it's probably more about numbers. There aren't enough eligible AMERICAN Black men, period. If BW were into WM as much as BM were into ALL RACES of women, you wouldn't hear the complaints. If BM outnumbered BW, you wouldn't hear the complaints. If BW opened themselves to the vast world of foreign Black men (who are often prizes intellectually, romantically and esthetically), you wouldn't hear the complaints. WW don't complain about the defection to Asian women (for whatever reasons), simply because she knows there is probably enough WM to go around. (even if not true, the perception breeds the reaction). The fact remains that MOST BM are with BW, so the issue of race and esteem as the excuse for sheer RUDENESS, is moot.
Correct, Only 5.5% of Black Men Married White Women in 2002 according to study by Binghamton University, while just over 12% married a WW in 2008. I have no problem with BW dating, marrying or preferring WM. I do find it funny the way BW look at me when I see them with WM, they expect me to give a damn, like I am going to roll my eyes,throw an evil look or say something stupid like some of them do. I do not concern myself with the opinions of strangers in regards to my relationships. I can honestly say that I would never deny myself love, marriage, sex, affection, friendship, passion, companionship, conversation, success or anything worthwhile because of fear or appeasement.
This nonesense will never stop, ans that's not me being pessimistic. In some shape or form throughout all human existence, there has always been some form of racial tension. I think this proves that the difference in our skin will always be used as a tool by some to try ans set us apart. Your post is spot on.
I just came across this post by a black woman and it really made me kind of sad - but it is also very insightful. The first few passages are about a certain situation she was in with a WW but then she's writing about IR relationships in general. It's a long post and I think she speaks her true feelings out - maybe it will be of interest to you. http://www.bnvillage.co.uk/village-square/102853-why-black-women-don-t-like-white-women.html What do you think about this? By the way: I really love to observe the discussions in here. I myself don't feel "entitled" to out my oar in most topics because I don't know much about american society. But I learn a lot (positive!) through you - thank you! :smt039 Edit: I don't get why a few people do this pigeonholing in general. Human beings can think, can't they?
This nonsense will stop. We just won't be alive to see it. As older generations die off and take their old ass conservative ways of thinking with them and newer generations introduce a new way of viewing the world the nonsense will slowly die off. The savior will be interracial mixing. Bob Dylan said it best "The times, they are a changin' "
