Richard Dawkins..

Lot of 'what ifs' there Reggie, but essentially my personal take is this:

If you have an opportunity to embrace Christianity and you choose not to, then yes that's on you. If you never have that opportunity to know that an alternative exists, then I do believe God recognizes that. As for terrorists, allowing yourself to be misled is on you, it's up to each person to question what other people try to entice them to do and determine if they believe it to be right and just. Murdering innocent people who have done nothing to you personally is not just, and in my mind that's something that anyone with good moral conviction would know is just plain wrong. If you are a person of low morals, then again that's on you, and I do believe you'll pay a price for that. I do not consider children forced to kill to save their own lives, or the lives of their families to be terrorists, I believe God will judge them based upon their hearts and not solely their actions. In the end what you think, or what I think doesn't matter, it's only what God thinks that makes a difference. He alone determines who goes where, and I don't believe there's a hard and fast set of rules that He follows.

 

Stop feeling yourself. I'm not angry. I'm just amazed by the lack of sense in your posts.

Here's a hint: don't bring shit to me unless you know you're right. Because I do research everything I say, online or IRL, and I don't take a position unless I know it's defendable. I have enough respect for the people here not to sprititedly defend an idiotic position.


eta: let me give you an example. I posted that the Pen & Teller vid as not credible "proof" not just because it did not address the issue directly but also because:

• I already knew who Pen & Teller were
• I knew how they came to popularity
• I had already heard enough of their published opinions to have an idea of their worldview
• I already knew a little bit about their show

Even still, BEFORE I posted I looked up their show & read reviews and interviews indicating that they presented an admitted bias.

I would never accuse someone's source of being invalid or biased without first determining that it was in fact invalid or biased. If I was too tired to bother clicking the "about" page at 2am, I wouldn't post till morning.

I respect other people's opinions too much to assume that I am always right without first verifying my position.

How many facists in the history of the world have said "I am a facist"?

omg. Seriously? Seriously? Seriously?

Fascism's just another way of living. Yeah. No, it's not bad.

Do you know what fascism is?

Stop saying stupid shit. Please. Just stop saying stupid shit. Look fascism up before you relegate it to "just another way of living". Oppressing people is not just another way of living. Tyranny is bad. It's not good.

Or, one could be like you, and argue that actually enslaving people is just "another way of living".

First of all, Communism = political; Socialism = economic; Democracy = political; Capitalism = economic. You're mixing apples and oranges.

Secondly, while you could instead say "Democracy is no better than the rest its just different", you'd still be wrong, because no, Fascism is always worse.

 

Interesting pov Esp. My only problem with a scenario where its on you to decipher what's wrong from right is not everyone is tested. Its an unfair system, if I'm wealthy and your poor more than likely I will never be in a situation where I'm tested to the same degree as someoneone who is less fortunate. I will never be in a position to steal or kill for food or shelter because those things are already available to me. I'm in a better position to give of my time and help the needy than a person who has to work all day to make ends meet.
I do believe actions do have consequences such is the nature of cause and effect but its hard to wrap my mind around a deity who punish everyone based on the same set of rules when its for some than others to follow it. Some people just have an easier time in life and will never be tempted norchallenged equally.
If God truly judges us for the few decades we're here I think he should make the playing field a little more fair.

 

To be fair we in the US live in facist state. For the slow kids Facist means corporate ran state and if you need proof check out how our government handled the BP situation. They were fined 20 billion dollars when the same company made 46 billion dollars last year during the worst recession ever. Socialism is also a politcal system where the citizens put into the state and its equally divided amongst the populus. It differs from Communism because Communism requires all citizens get paid the same and give the same amount to the government destroying incentive. And let's face it Capitalism is our political system corporations have far more influence over our government than the people they represent.

 

That was my point Andrae, I don't believe we are all judged by the same set of rules. I agree also that some people appear to have it all, but my experience tells me that everyone gets tested, just in different ways and some don't show it outwardly. I have other thoughts on the subject that I'm not going to get into here, but I will say that I believe the stronger your faith, the more you're tested in life.

 

I don't know because if there's anything that life teaches me is that faith has little to do with innocence and the innocent can tested far more than anyone. People who live in natural disaster prone areas are tested way more so than you and I. Its just sad thinking that after going through the hell that's called life that someone would judge you on it when all most of us want to do is make it day to day.

 

Socialism is an economic system. Communism is a political system. Often they go together, but not always. Capitalism is an economic system.

It's reasonable to argue that the political systems heavily impact the economies, or that they favor certain economic systems, and vice versa, which is of course true, but it's important to realize the meaning of the terms when we talk about this stuff because there are a lot of political crazies in the world who just lump these things together and use them as scare tactics. It's important to know what they really mean.

There are indeed (of course) levels of fascism in our current state, but there is also a great deal of freedom and tolerance.

 

:smt056

The way you stated that reminds me of someone I knew Andrae. Her take on life was that this is Hell and the goal was to get through this life and do as little damage as possible to other people and when you died you automatically went to Heaven. She and I didn't agree on that, or on faith in general, but it didn't make me love her any less. I just understood that life left her jaded, and that her POV was tainted by that, and I hoped she would one day see it differently. She thought God was indifferent, which I think is unfortunate because I know He's not. I honestly believe that when the time comes, God will consider everything you've done in your life, and nothing will be overlooked. I also believe that you'll never fully appreciate the repercussion of even the smallest random act of kindness you perform, but He knows all and those can tip the scales. Ultimately I think God wants to see someone who tried, and never gave up, and that makes the most difference. Hell isn't for people who try and fail, it's for people who renounce God and succeed.

 

Freedom is an illusion Chi. You're only as free as you are rich in our current penial system. Whether or not you lose months or years of your life comes down to whether or not you have bail money not if you're innocent or not. Yes we have some tolerance but not a whole lot.

 

I too think if there is a God he/she is indifferent to what happens on this planet. The Universe is so big and vast that it seems HIGHLY unlikely that God concerns himself with us. I was watching the Science or Discovery Channel and they had a size comparison between the Earth and the Universe that a person could wrap their mind around easier than say the Universe is 100 billion light years across. If the United States represented the size of the Universe then Earth would be the size of a push inside the US. Could you imagine trying to find a push pin in your backyard let alone the entire United States. Or, there are more Stars in the Universe than there are grains of sand on every beach in the world. The logically side of me can't get over those type of numbers. The thing is scientist believe that the universe is even bigger than 100 billion light years across. That number is only what we can see with our telescopes.

For me there are too many wrong doings in this world for me to justify a God that actually cares. I mean I know they say he works in mysterious ways but what good comes out of grown men molesting 6 month old babies? What about men that are wrongfully sent to prison and 20, 25, 30 yrs later find out the man was innocent. How many men were wrongfully put to death on death row? What about the despair that the continent of Africa has had to endure since contact with white men?

I can't sit here and say that God is not real but I'm almost willing to bet my life on it that God doesn't really concern himself with humans. I think that since man was able to walk upright there were certain things he wanted to know. What was that big blinding yellow thing in the sky? What is that big white circle in the sky at night? What about all those tiny dots in the night sky? Where do we come from? What happens when we die? As man did then and continues to do now he tried to make sense of his environment the best way he could. I think this is where religion sprung up, evolved, and eventually written down and became a true religion. These traditions were past down from generation to generation, where we have people still practicing traditions that came about 2, 3, 4 thousand years ago.

 

I don't believe Him to be indifferent, nor do I think that explains all the evil that occurs in the world. He is beyond comprehension, and therefore I know we aren't meant to understand. That's where the faith comes in.

I can appreciate where people get that impression, that's just not how I see it Reggie.

 

It seems from my point of view at least Andrae and I kind are coming from a similar angle with this, I could be wrong though. But look at the tone and language you use with him as opposed to me. No saying his post make no sense, no cursing, no saying that his viewpoint is wrong, etc. Everything is subjective. I too feel slavery is wrong, killing is wrong, stealing is wrong, but everything has a context and you can't just say killing is wrong across the board.

 

It might be arrogant of me to think this but I feel like I do see where God is coming from. I feel like even though my understanding isn't complete its getting there.

 

Andrae didn't say "Fascism is just another way of living" or suggest that it wasn't "bad".

If you don't want me to say your viewpoint is wrong, don't say things that anyone with a mouseclick can prove to be wrong.

If you don't want me to be insulting, don't insult everyone here by saying utterly ridiculous things like Fascism isn't bad.

If you don't want me to curse, kick rocks, because I'm not changing who I am for some random internet person, and who I am is a grown ass Woman who curses when she motherfucking feels like it.

 

Reggie I got a great book for you that changed my entire life. Conversations with God an Uncommon dialogue by Neale Donald Walsch is amazing. I have the book on audio if you'd like to hear a few chapters just let me know.

 

Holy shit am I the only one with a little wood right now. Easy Chi lol

 

That's not arrogant Andrae, that's good. I comprehend Him more now than I did when I was younger, I think that's logical given that our comprehension skills, and reasoning abilities grow as we get older.

BTW, I hope my favorite Jamaican's having a better day.

 

Much better. I had a morning Krav Maga class and worked on my book. Therapy of the Gods I tell you. Thanks again beautiful.

 

That's good to hear.