question?

I think the problem is the “corporatization” of our world.

Women coming into the work force should have opened the doors to more ideas and a different prospective in most cases but to most men it was just more competition.

I don’t believe that women from other countries are any better or worst than the women here but when you step back and look at what’s going on, people are always played against others and most people placed in our society will find themselves at odds with anyone “outside” of the group.
Our groups are based on sex, race, religion, and class.

I use to think it was money over class but I’ve learned that no matter how much money you have, some people will never be seen as equal in class.

 

I think we can agree that women are generally viewed as equals in the workplace and don't give me those POOR examples of hitting a "glass ceiling", many women are in CEO and COO position in major companies, maybe not in old school companies like Coke, Ford, GM and those like them, but new generation companies like HP.

WSD -

What you should DO is raise your daughter to respect others and not be so quick to judge based on factors that have NOTHING TO DO WITH HOW A MAN WILL TREAT YOU.

AW dog me for living at home, like I have always been here and never left. They don't the whole story so they are quick to reduce me to scrub status.

Like I said I have a plan and I should start building (yes I said BUILD) my home this time next year, if not a bit later than that.

As for women not being different in other parts of the world, all you have to do is talk to them and then draw your own conclusion. That's not to say you don't have status seekers and gold diggers in Europe. But the TRUTH of the matter is, that Black American Men NOT IN THE MILITARY are in HIGH DEMAND in Western Europe.

If they just wanted black men, they could settle for Africans, but the cultural differences between Western Culture and typical African culture differ enough that alot of women over there just don't want to be bothered with Africans.

That's not to say that African and European pairing don't happen they do, but more often that not then end in tears, that's based on my meager at best research.

Most women in Europe are interested in is a man that can be faithful, something Americans in our armed forces seem to have difficulty with, you don't know HOW many times I have heard from German women for example how unfaithful American Black males can be over there.

Take that information for what its worth, mainly nothing but the stats speaks for themselves if you ever bothered to have a random poll on say Blackplanet...

So go on believing that European women aren't better for you. Or go on thinking that you'll have to spend over 50% of your life span looking for a woman that fits your needs here in America.

If you willing to overlook problems like having an ass wider than the hatch opening on a Honda Civic, then by all means stick to your guns here and save some money. Afterall the money I have spent in talking to women overseas, I could have bought a nice used car.

This venture is not for everybody

 

Everyone has to live their life as they see fit... And you know whats best for you. Really.

As far as women in the work place go:
I work for a top Fortune 500 company and women are not seen as equals.
The glass ceiling is very real and you don't need to be a woman to see that.
Sure there are some who make it far up the food chain just as there are some people of color up there as well but make no mistake about it.
We all have a very long way to go before we find "equal".

 

Designer,

Interesting take. Please expand on what you mean by "corporatization” of our world."

I think we will be in agreement if your line of thinking is similiar to mine.

Women are judged, and we learn this at a young age, on our looks, not our sparkling personality.

We are in direct competetion with each other at all times. This attitude is carried over into adulthood and into corporate america. I have not seen a nastier bunch of females in all my life.

If you are young and pretty, you might have it easier for a time because the male dominated environment sets it up that way or I should say the white male dominated. But then again if you are cute, you get the "she must be brainless bit" ALL THE TIME.

As some men like to say a woman has a "self life", there will always be someone younger and prettier than you...eventually....so you damn well better be a hard ass, work impossibly long hours whether you have children or not and do some major brown nosing......if you want to keep up with the males doing the same job as you and even then you won't, just ain't gonna happen.

That I find very interesting. Do you think it is race based? Could you expound on that idea?


dj4monie,

Now that I think is a given. For her I hope one day a man pays her the highest compliment and tells her what her father told me, "You are like no woman I have ever met, you think differently."

I have issues with woman, I do not like their thinking or behavior in too many numerous situations to discuss. This in in direct relation to how we, as woman, directly and indirectly are taught to think and behave by society. And it ain't pretty.

How I wound up married with children must have been part of the "GRAND DESIGN" because I sure as hell never wanted to be trapped into trusting another so completely.

Because now as a WIFE and MOTHER I have sacrificed MUCH in every department of my life...At least..thank the lord in heaven...he did not see fit to give me stretch marks.....see, even now I am still poisoned by conditioning.....

I don't believe in divorce, I think it selfish, unless there is abuse. Now when a man is divorced his options are open, for a woman limited, if she has kids. Kids are the biggest detractor, and it is the woman who pays the heaviest fee.

I do not know where you live, but I see plenty of in shape chics I would love to drag home.....if I was single SO I don't see European women having the market on slimness or attractiveness.

You said you did not want to spend over 50% of your life looking for a mate. I find that comment of interest to me, given that you are a man.

I think it rare for a man to want to settle down and marry in their 20s. I suppose they exist but I would think most would want to play the field as long as possible, they don't have shelf life.

I can't speak for most woman but when I met my husband he was living at home and making about as much as I was. The only thing I didn't like about his living arrangement was that he always had to come to NYC from Phillie, else there would be no booty to have, cause we were not getting nasty with his father just down the hall...ugh....(his mom had long since left.)

Maybe I don't judge men by factors that have nothing to do with how he treats me, I was always very keen on discerning just where a man's head was at and consequently the behavior I could expect from him.

I stuck by my guy, I chose him when he wanted to be exclusive, and decided to carry his child to term, I guess I am not so damaged that I couldn't find it in myself to trust him with the biggest event in a woman's life, a child, life altering.

I am glad I did, he is a wonderful father, earns six figures now through his own astonishing perserverance, and is still ambitious....but I guess he did wait until his life was almost 50% over until he found the right woman for him, but I think he liked it that way.

To me you seem bitter, or rather that is the tone I read in your post. Mind revealing your age? By all means have at it with Euro chics, I sincerely hope you find what you are looking for. But even a svelte Euro chic can get an ass as wide as a civic once she has you in matrimony with a couple of kids....it's all about self image.

Personally I am much to vain to let myself go, and that is in direct relation to how woman are brought up!

Please excuse the novella.....

 

“Corporatization”
Larger companies buying smaller companies.
People working for larger corporations when those very same people have the abilities to start their own companies.
Corporate power reaching the point of having far more influence on world leaders and governments and then using that power to create change that benefits the business over the quality of life of people.
Think about the early release of unsafe drugs to the public.
Think about eminent domain

Not too long ago people use to go to school to become better people [well rounded] and to add something to their smaller communities or the greater society.
Now the only reason most people go to school is to get a better job working for a larger corporation and the drive and desire to add to and not just consume is all but gone.

We teach people that we need this product or that product to be happy.
That you are the center of the universe or at least you will be once you buy this new car or once you drink this beer.


Class
I think it is race based as that will insure that no matter how far we [the US] fall out of our Super Power status or no matter how many people from other countries come over the current ruling class will still have a place at the power table and can therefore affect change.

I do want to go on the record as saying that it’s not just at the hands of white males that these things take place so my “us and them” is not about race or sex but right and wrong.
We all have it in use to be right or wrong.

WhiteSheDevil challenging the old Designer!!

I likes!

 

Old Designer, my foot! HA, unless you are over fifty then I gotta draw the line since that is a wee bit too close to my mama's age...tehehe...

Let's get it on, one of my fav topics,

Big business running this country coupled with materialism and class.....you have no idea what can of worms you just opened with me.

Agreed that all talent is geared to the best and biggest companies in order to make as much money as possible. Although where the real money is at is in owning your own business that is the surest way to become independantly wealthy.

However, I encouraged my husband to keep changing jobs until he found himself in one of those big assed corps, why? Well of course the money, and it is paying off. Also when working in the smaller companies the employees are often raped benefits and salary wise in order for that company to hit their projected marks and since jobs are harder and harder to come by, they get away with it. He used to work upwards to 70hrs or more a week for a laughable salary and a suckie HMO (thank god we still didn't have that when that doctor tried his hardest to take him out).

A fact that won't change nevermind the changing racial dynamic of this country, is that a top elite, 1%, run 90% of the wealth in this country. They make government policy through lobbyist. That is why I say this country is no longer a true democracy but run by corporations and their collective interests.

This has devastating effects, trickle down economics don't work, that is a lie that's told to pacify. The gap between the haves and have nots is getting wider everyday, until the point where the middle class will eventually be squeezed out.

This country is obsessed with material possessions. You gotta have "this" to be as seen as someone with consequence and this thinking puts the wealth squarely right back into said corporations.

There is a drug to "cure" any illness conceived. It is a damn joke, these things haven't been properly tested and they flood the market with them anyway. Think about the surge in commercials for these things. This is a relatively new phenomenon. The drug use in children has climbed to outrageous porportions and these drugs are supposed to be for adults!!

All to true, but if you want to survive, what choice do you have? Even if you start your own business, the cards are stacked against you and you will be competing against said corporations. And IF and that's a big if, you come up with something original, chances are your idea will be snatched up by big business because you'll find yourself manuevered into a situation where the only out is to sell.

Materialism is destroying this country. It starts at a young age perpetrated by the adults. It is all around you. A constant message bombarding your senses. Woman especially get caught up with this yardstick for so called success. We are taught at a young age our worth is based directly on looks and where we stand in the order of things(how wealthy are our parents, can they afford that new car at 16, and vacations to exotic locals).

Agreed that the 1% will always run things. However with your next statement I am unclear as to the point you are making .

Can't wait to hear what you gotta say about that!

 

Sometimes we/I fall into the old trap of the blame game.
So my “on the record” was maybe more for my own demons than anything else.
We are all the reason why things are as they are....


You are right about uncontrolled materialism killing our country and the world.
We live in a consume and consume some more state of mind driven by corporate America's need to make even more money.

There is an old saying: Take what you need but need what you take.
I'm trying to find my way back to that.
Why?
Because I sold out.
I use to be a counterculture type in my 20's. I was a member of Greenpeace and stuff.
I knew right from wrong!!
BUT
I cut my hair and joined corporate America as a sellout.
Had a SUV too!!!

I just need to get back to what I know is right.

Money is a good tool to have but when money becomes a god, and judge, and wall, we are in trouble.

Balance is the future.
For me anyway....

I have a little ways to go before I break 50.... :lol:

 

designer,

why do you feel like a sellout? 'cause you adopted the style of dress demanded of you by corporate America?

Did you sink into materialism?

You bought an SUV, to look good, not becuase you need a four wheel drive vehicle?

curious......

 

I had an option to go with a station-wagon or an SUV.
I did need the room at the time but a large part of me wanted the SUV because of the image factor. Sellout.
I did and had a chance to do my own thing [my own business] but I went with Big Corporate America.com because it was easier and the money. Sellout.

I grew up in this whole counter culture world and many of my close friends are/were counter culture types.
I don't really like the political, hypocritical, sexist, racist and money crazed corporate culture but I go there 5 to 7 days a week for the money..... SELLOUT!

I had this dream of living in an eclectic in-town neighborhood.
Living with some cool art chick with a hip art school style dressed in black all free and happy and green and stuff.
Not slaves to convention. Not concerned with popular opinion. Not the stress filled average work-a-day person.
Now I live the life of Mr. All American Suburban Guy. Super Sell the F@ck Out.

Now I'm all depressed.
You happy now? 8)

As far as the change to fit the corporate look and environment, I do understand the whole "when in Rome" thing. Not a sellout but just the right thing for the job. :roll:


Note to self:
Must listen to old Live - Throwing Copper CD.
Remember the good old days....

 

poor baby doll...*smooches* just get over it already *sends over cyber zoloft*

So seems to me you were conflicted and now looking back you regret some decisions. Now is the time to change direction, but you perceive it as too late to do so.

Agreed you should have started your own business when younger, best way to become idependently wealthly and just plain independent.

Best way to get some of that mojo back is to find a younger chick who still has all those ideals and will pull your surburban ass outta your rut!

completely agree with you but what is the alternative? There really isn't one. You kind of have to make your life outside of that existance f'ing fantastic to make up for it, ya know?

She exists I swear it designer she does, that counter culture, hip, black wearing, sexy assed, sassy chica, just find her and happiness is yours *so says the all seeing eye*

And that little movie you got as your sig, is really how you feel inside isn't it? LOL......

 

It is!!!!
All those little demons beating the snot out of me every freaking day!!!

You are 100% right about finding my life outside of work which is what I try to do as much as possible... But....

Now don't get me wrong I love being able to pay my bills and having some left over.
I like the fact that I can help to financially support some of the causes I believe in but I use to be in the game and not just a paying spectator.
I really feel lucky in that I never fell into the pitfalls that hinder many black males in America [lack of education/real skills, drug habit, criminal record/background] so I was able to have some choices and I do look back and wonder "what if my choice was different" but I think we all do that at some point.
One day you look at yourself and you think "Geez. I'm middle America!!" Not what I thought I would be 20 years ago.
It could be worst however.

Now my little spiritual advisor....
Where is this cool hip arty chick????

You know, you're alright Pale Female Beelzebub. 8)

 

hmmm let me see *opens all seeing eye*

she is the young girl in the other department with the phat ass and sassy attitude...

she is the quiet girl a couple cubes over....

she's the girl at the dermatologists getting that tattoo removed that she just LOVED at 18....

she's that girl AT the tattoo parlor getting that tattoo from 18 covered up..
or she's getting another one....

she's getting another piercing, somewhere neat...

she's at the gym, trying to lose that extra 10 she gained when she hit her 30s and her metabolism went out the window.....

she's at the park with her kid (yeah she has one, nobody's perfect)....

she's at Borders, just bought another Sookie Stackhouse vampire novel....or she's a REAL freak and picked up the latest Anita Blake Vampire Hunter....

Or she's desperate and she in a BAR, and all there is are a bunch of annoying young bucks not worth her time...

she's at the cornor store buying a box of dutches 'cause she still likes to get her smoke on...lol...

.....damn...D...she's out there somewhere...I know it, waiting for you!

So says PFB......


LIVE huh, careful you are showing your age....

Me I was a real snob about my music...loved obscure shyte, hated it if it went mainstream...you know, cause then they sold out. Liked NIN until the jock football player (who had a crush on me) used them as a conversation opener....my little punk rock 16yr old heart was horrified! LMAO

Understood, about how you appreciate what you have and all that, but can't help feeling like you are sitting there saying..this can't be it?

And it shouldn't be, you're right something is missing and you know it...it's a bitch being a scorp......you're at the best point in life...men in their 40s are uber sexy...and y'all know it

edited to add...you aaiiight yourself....designer....



edited again to add....

she's at your highschool reunion (I know *gag*) but the way I found out about the football player and his crush was running into him years later and him admitting it to me......well he did ask me out once but I thought his friends set him up to do it, I mean really, you just DON'T cross social groups like that, there are RULES about that sort of thing!!

edited for the last time:

where she really is.....is at class, 'cause she never finished up school...to busy partying...so she's prolly serving or bartending or temping or some other sub par job while she gets her degree....okay designer I'll leave you alone, I know how you get......we do like to keep things close to home.

 

Designer and SheDevil, keep it up this convo is very entertaining :wink:

 

:lol: :lol: :lol:
My sista!!!! [or is it sister?.... I never know] 8)

Chigirl
Don't stand on the sidelines...
You bring some entertainment too.

 

Naw designer I am truly just me......

I'll say this though there is a troll here. He/she/it has about five different screen names right now on this board. I recognize....I should it's been roughly 7yrs. I posted here first back in 2000. I was so innocent to games people play. How I HATE to be lied to (I know a bit hypocritical since I've cheated before but I was in my idealistic stage then and past all that sneakin' and cheatin'!)......anyway he was exposed, the board was redone, I went somewhere else, and grew up some....this FREAK...I swear I can almost smell him/her/it......has some serious issues......and posted at the other place...where I could tell eventhough there were different screen names by the style/subject matter/references.......

Ever since then I have been painfully honest or very quiet about myself...something about a public forum *shrugs*


Other than that I suck at spotting trolls....except maybe this one person...other than that I think the people here seem pretty sincere and open minded and I am glad I came back...

 

I'm glad you came back too. From my heart.

But don't read too much into the sista/sister thing....
I really meant nothing by that other than you seem more of a sister on a soul and spiritual level to me.

When I say sister/sista to you, I mean brother sister and not from a race standpoint.

Cool???


Now on the troll front...
We have a few and they hide it well but that's the way of things on the internet. Any place where people are working to come together across cultural and racial lines, you have to know that those forces against it will be there too.

We can hate each other and that's fine.
You talk about love [not sex. Love] and "Oh no. We gotta stop that shyt!"

:roll: :roll: :roll: What are you going to do?

 

Yeah I am feelin' that too...as unexpected as it is to me....and I'm trying REAL HARD not to flirt with you....so go easy on me :shock: 8)

I am a married woman, and I do not like to be disrespectful, but I was SUCH a flirt before I got married, I'm sure you can just imagine

Naw really though, I do know what you mean....We cool....


And this particular troll isn't actually anti IR just has some strange, I guess I could use the word fetishes.....

I know the others just froth at the mouth....I gotta keep in mind this board links to racist site.....

 

shedevil & designer...are you two talking in some kind of code...i am totally lost...either that or just not paying close enough attention...trolls? where?

 

lipstick,

I am convinced a couple of new (ish) screen names are this certain troll that I have known for years....I can tell by the way it post, what it talks about, and how it posts, I have my suspicions as to which they are....it just irritates the hell outta me!

 

Trolls.WSD

:? Trolls suck ass. We just had one that keeps on coming back month after month. Is there a way to keep them out?I don't know.
Most do not like my idea on this......any other ideas?