How many Calls to a woman?

My sisters & I recently had this conversation & they seem to think that I give up too easily when it comes to women & always assume the worst.

Growing up with & once sharing an apartment with two lovely sisters I realized that women are sensitive to men's feelings & sometimes simply hate to tell a man when they are not interested. So I was compelled dozens of times to get on the phone & lie to some poor guy & tell him my sisters weren't home(as they sat by & laughed to themselves) until the guy simply tires of calling. That's when I learned to almost never ever ask a woman for her phone number! I simply give her mine & if she doesn't call? I move on. I found this to be a good way to save myself some dignity when it comes to the dating game.

If I am having an interesting conversation with a woman I simply offer my number to her & invite her to finish our discussion by phone. Sometimes I suggest an exchange ,but mostly if she doesn't offer I don't ask. Just my way of saving face over someone who may not be interested.

Well several weeks ago I exchanged numbers with a woman(first such interaction with a white woman) & I called & left a message(including my number) ,but got no return call. I never called again & eventually threw her number away.

My sisters & friends have always accused me of giving up too easily. Saying "well she may have not gotten your message" ,"Lost your number",etc... But that has always been how I handle a situation when I have a woman's number & she doesn't return my call. I assumed she doesn't want to be bothered & moved on.

So are my sisters right? Is one phone call without a response not enough? I don't, but I would like to know your feelings(especially women) on this.
Am I being too passive by only giving my number & rarely asking for hers?

 

don't judge based on your sisters.

I for instance am not a big phone person. When a guy gives me a number, I RARELY call it. I want him to call me.

The last guy that got with me for something serious... he kept calling.. and calling and calling..

it wasn't that I wasn't interested, but I had a lot going on.. and quite honestly I was casually dating about three guys at the time. But he was determined.. and eventually we started dating seriously and I stopped seeing the other men.

If he had just given up after one call.. we'd have never gotten together..


although on the other hand, that might have saved me some heartache... but that is another subject.

 

yes.

Ask for hers.

If she is interested, she will give it to you. If she doesn't, and doesn't have a good excuse why not to give it to you.. then you know not to waste your time

 

Thanx Sassy for your advice. But there was a Hip Hop record I remember when I was growing up called "Bug-a-boo" which referred to people who constantly call ( "bug") someone who isn't interested. I guess I just don't want to be a "Bug-a-boo". Again I don't have a problem approaching women I just don't really ask for there numbers. Give mine & let the chips fall.

Also I am not only going by experience with sisters just women in general seem not to want to hurt a man's feelings by telling him they are not interested especially if the guy is a gentleman.

So I think I will go more with the exchange of numbers approach. A call or two & leaving my phone number should be more than enough right?So a woman would prefer that I call to know I'm truly interested ?

 

lol.. yeah I know the song..

trust me.. you are not a Bug a Boo...


Seriously.. some women like a little chasing..

there is a balance.. but she likes to know you are truly interested and not just bored so looking to fill some time because no one else was free..

 

It's funny, the whole art of dating is often lost on me. The times and the methods used to meet women have changed tenfold. In some respects it seems that we have come around full circle...

I've tried Internet dating and found that this method brings about a whole new set of rules and etiquette. I have grown quite accustomed to speaking to a woman and then asking for her number. I'd wait the mandatory 24-72 hours, call her and see where the experience takes me. I'd say it's been 50/50. The Internet changes the game completely. The Internet enables a woman and man to judge one another not by their speaking ability or swagger but purely on physical appearance and writing ability. A man who has the gift of gab is powerless on the Internet unless he can transcend that gift onto a suitor's screen. Correspondence has replaced conversation and now "when to call" is replaced with "should we meet?" As a Internet dating novice, I suggested to one woman that we exchange phone numbers far too soon. She was highly offended and cut all communication with me immediately. She felt that my forwardness was abrupt and very evasive. We had corresponded via email for weeks... I've asked women that I've known for minutes for their number and did not get a response like that.
The irony is that my grandmother thought it was appalling that a girl would give me her home phone number. In her day, she explained, if a man wanted to court a woman he came to her house and met her parents. The lust-filled couple would sit on the porch or in the family room and talk to one another. If he was truly interested, the man would send letters to the woman, regardless of his proximity to her house. This would go on for a few months and eventually they would jump the broom. She said, "Any hussy that would give you her phone number is not the type of woman you want." Makes me wonder if my grandmother would have been successful on Match.com.

My 2 Lincolns are as follows: Personally, I think women make it too damn hard for a man to court them. I can understand why, but jeez! An attractive young lady should not be forced to entertain every advance towards her but ladies, you need a different weeding out process. Some of the most aggressive men I know in business, sports and other of life's virtues are pussycats when it comes to women. It's as if a woman's vagina (or the lust for it) is the great equalizer. There has to be a better way to decide who is the good guy and who is the psycho deranged idiot. Men who want nothing more than to commit to a woman and truly love her or being cast aside because their game just isn't as strong as a so-called player. I submit this for your pondering ladies -

Wouldn't it behoove you to date a man with no game? Then you know he hasn't been perfecting his craft on every other woman in the world. Practice makes perfect. So how about given the guy that appears to have never spoken to a woman in life a chance... then your chances of being a victim or a notch in someones belt has to be decreased significantly.
Respectfully submitted,
TMASS

 

:smt038 Damn, Tmass, you pretty much summed up my feelings about Internet Dating.

 

Interesting post T. I don't get what type of woman am I though for giving my number whenever I please to, sometimes since the first convo sometimes never. Well.....but whatever :roll: he he he....
I hate following certain rules and certain routes that are OKAY, and deadlines till something is ok or not. Rules are governing all other areas of our lives, can't we leave a little space for spontaneity at least in the love area? I don't get whats with the women who act like beaten by a snake when a guy asks for their phone number, even after seconds. Whats offensive or outrageous about that? He didnt say Voulez vous coucher avec moi ce soir for gods sake !

To answer your question, yes I'd much more like a man with no game. Games are anyway sooooo predictable and well known and 281641 times played before and its a sign of insecurity in my opinion to follow a recipe (I'll call after 3 days so I wont seem too interested, I'll do this like that and this like that so she will not think.......and she will not think.......pleeeaaaaaaase........). And yes, there is a certain something that makes me feel safe about a guy who doesnt seem overconfident and knows exactly what to say and when to say it. But I have a feeling not many women would give a similar reply, and maybe your question was rethorical anyway.

 

[quote="Seychelles" To answer your question, yes I'd much more like a man with no game. Games are anyway sooooo predictable and well known and 281641 times played before and its a sign of insecurity in my opinion to follow a recipe (I'll call after 3 days so I wont seem too interested, I'll do this like that and this like that so she will not think.......and she will not think.......pleeeaaaaaaase........). And yes, there is a certain something that makes me feel safe about a guy who doesn't seem overconfident and knows exactly what to say and when to say it. But I have a feeling not many women would give a similar reply, and maybe your question was rhetorical anyway.[/quote]

Seychelles
My question wasn't at all rhetorical. I was really interested in an answer. I applaud you for taking the road less traveled. I'm not giving excuses but I would submit to you that many men play these games because they are forced to. It's the theory of evolution (if you believe in such things) that we must evolved to survive. If a man wants to be with a woman than he must study her behavior and actions and adapt to his surroundings. I admit there are those men out there who want nothing more than to mess with a woman's mind, but I really truly believe they are few and far between. I think that most "nice guys" are nice guys only because they've allowed themselves to be beat up by love. Once you've been vulnerable two reactions will result. One, you decide that it will never happen again and close yourself off to the possibility of love. Two, you are mindful of your treatment and vow to never treat anyone so poorly. Unfortunately, most people adopt the first reaction and not the latter. Seriously, and this is not rhetorical, would you give a guy a chance if he was sincere and said to you, "I am absolutely amazed at how beautiful you are. I honestly don't know what the exact words are but I would love to say something that will convince you to that I'm worth getting to know."
It's not a line. It's something that I felt and said to a very attractive woman. The result? I've seen less blood in a Friday the 13th movie. So tell me, what's a man to do?

 

I would. Although most of my friends say I am too gullable.. But for me, until a man's actions show he is playing games, he gets a clean slate and I take him at his word.

 

Unfortunately Sassy, I would have to say you are in a minority. I consider myself a good man. I've never cheated on a woman and I've learned through the years to respect women. I've played the game and, in my youth, I've played games. At this juncture of my life, I'd love to meet a woman (a white woman because that's my preference) that will love and respect me unequivocally. I can understand the frustration of many men because women seem to go to great lengths to make the dating process so difficult. I believe that anything worth having is worth fighting for but why must love be such an impossible fight?
As I get older, my fantasies have transcended adolescent dreams of multiple women and sexual escapades. I now fantasize about relationships... like sitting on the couch in some sweats and watching a movie. It just seems discouraging that so many women want a good man and there are so many good men that will never find them.

Remember the movie Hitch? I know it was just a movie but there was something he said that stands true. His job was to help women get out of their own way and meet a great guy. A guy that doesn't fit the model model. I'm no Taye Diggs or Shemar Moore but that should be the exact reason that I'm ideal. Those brothers and brothers like them that have women throwing themselves at them will find it very difficult to be true to one woman. Chris Rock said it best, "a man is only as faithful as his options."

I guess my request to all women is that once, just once give a sincere guy who may not necessarily be your first choice a shot... I think you will be pleasantly surprised.

 

sounds like a good fantasy to me.. hopefully it will become a reality.

Not all of us need a Taye Diggs.. the most handsome man I ever dated was a Denzel look alike. He was also the most ugly man underneath. He taught me a lesson to look past just a handsome face. To find out what is underneath. I guess I'll always be guilty of still preferring blk skin because I can't help it. But when I converse with a guy if we meet online. I usually do not even ask to see what he looks like right away. To be honest I want to know who he is inside first. I'd prefer to use my other senses to get to know him first..

unless I think he's a white guy trying to appear to be black just because he knows my preference.. then I ask for a picture. (believe me.. its happened).

I think there are plenty of us looking for a good man. How we all keep missing each other, I don't know.

 

oh yeah.. and I loved the movie Hitch. I sat two of my sons down to watch it.. wanted them to learn a few tips from the story.

 

This thread was a breath of fresh air to read. So far, all of the replies have been well-thought out, at least by my standpoint.

 

Dang! If the 'Schwarzen----a dude' is having trouble with this dating game I think I'm gonna hang it up now! Can anyone recommend a good monastery?


Seriously though Sassy in order not to be a pest I try to take hints from women because from my experience women are reluctant to ,they believe, 'hurt someones feelings' by rejecting him(if he's a gentleman). I think men for the most part ,however, take polite rejection real well.

From what I've heard some women like a little 'chasing' but that's were dating becomes a game that's a little frustrating. I've even heard some women say that "at first I wasn't interested in him at all ,but he was persistent' :shock:

That's what I am trying to figure out. Where is that 'balance' between persistence/chasing or annoying/harassment? I am very reluctant to cross that line into annoyance/harassment. Is there an answer or simply one of those things you have to intuitively figure out for ones self?

 

well if it makes you feel any better, we have trouble figuring you guys out too!

I don't know if I should call a guy necessarily either.. or even send an email. If you send it right away do you scare them off? because you seem too interested?

A friend of mine used to wait three days to do anything, so that she didn't appear TOO interested. EVEN if she was!

We all have to play it by ear.

 

:smt038 :smt038 :smt038 :smt038 :smt038

I just had to come out of hiding to applaud these comments.

 

I am coming to the party a little late, but TMass, I very much agree with your thoughts here! This one especially has much truth in it. I wish more guys out there thought the way that you did and didn't waste so much time studying and perfecting their "game". That is not attractive to me nor most quality women. Only experience has taught me how to recognize "game", I am better at seeing it now though the slick ones still get by me sometimes. It is good to know that GOOD ONES like yourself are out there

As for the topic at hand...
If you *really* like a woman, don't give up after one call. Give it a few days (just so you don't come across as desparate or stalker-ish) and try again. If after the 2nd call she doesn't respond, then forget about her. Don't take it personally...there could be 100 different reasons why and as she doesn't even know you, she can't really be rejecting you as a person. Just move on and keep trying!
I like persistance myself (as a general quality) but there is a fine line between persistance and annoyance. Allowing a little time between calls, and then knowing when to give up, is pretty much all you need to know.

 

I agree with marieSF, I'll call a lady once and leave a message, If she does not return my call immediately, I'll wait about a week and call back a second time. If I get no call back then it's time to move on. Usually I'll get a callback after a few weeks, when it dawns on the lady that the friendship is about to vaporize.......unfortunately at this point I've lost all interest in continuing the relationship.

 

I will try two phone calls to her , a few days apart , and two e-mails , a few days apart .

If I don't get a friendly response ................

I throwout the number .

End of story .





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