Has Hiphop done more to harm the Black community than good?

Blame the Number-Crunching Grey Suits with their clipboards that run today's Record Labels & Radio Stations (And the Mass Media, overall) for how the music scene has degenerated so badly....making all that's negative about that genre go so mainstream...thereby choking off any other aspect of said genre..particularly that which emphasises positive, as opposed to negative..















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Hip Hop has indeed destroyed a whole generation of black kids who cannot compete with the new immigrants and the world in general with values and ethics contrary to the proud black achievements of the black greatest generations of the past. I blame todays parents, the so-called black political leaders who only want to be popular and not tell it like it is and the black church which has long lost credibility.

 

I agree with everything you said but what I find to be our biggest unaddressed issues is lack of cohesion. We are worst to each other more so than any outside race. With all the wealth accumulated from entertainers ie rappers singers actors and sport stars. Why aren't there more all black private schools or more black owned corporations? Our biggest problem as a culture is everyone wants to be the boss but no one wants to work together. As far as hip hop is concerned people have to grow up and stop blaming media for their problems. The I shot someone because Snoop Dog said to is weak. We choose what we allow to influence us so hip hop is not the problem. It's only a reflection of what people want to be entertained by. At one point the stories fascinated those who knew nothing about "black" struggles and now it's all drugs and shake your ass music. The labels couldn't put this out if consumers didn't want it.

 

I don't think harm is the correct word. Destroying is.

 

In some ways, both hop hop and the thug culture has destroyed the generation of young blacks.

 

Yeah, Hip Hop culture has contributed to the problems of the black community. But after reading The Fourth Turning, I now see that those problems are a sign that we are making a lot of progress. The reason is that the thug culture is typically what you see in a Third Turning. You see the rise of gang violence, rampant drug use, widening wealth gap, irrationalism, culture wars, identity politics, etc. Of course, we've seen a lot of this in the 1980s and 1990s. This is not unprecedented at all. The same trends were apparent in the 1910s and 1920s, the 1850s, and the 1760s. All were overloaded with youth gangs, violence, and crime. Hedonism was unusually popular, as were culture wars arguments, and the political system was gridlocked.

Each third turning was followed by the fourth turning. Crime decreases markedly during the fourth turning. Culture wars arguments come to an end. The fourth turning is by far the darkest and scariest of all turnings. These usually feature major wars, revolutions, social upheaval, major political change, economic catastrophes. But they also feature social renewal, and mark the creation of a new society. The fourth turning changes society's institutions beyond prior recognition. These are the founding moments in America's history. Prior fourth turnings include the Great Depression and World War II, the Civil War (and Reconstruction?), and the American Revolutionary period. All featured major catastrophic war, catastrophic economic collapse, and major political, institutional, infrastructural, and social change. All were overloaded with fear, strife, suffering. But they all had a new sense of community, a new social consensus, a new rise of intellectualism, and a new grass-roots effort to take charge and fix society's problems. We are in the fourth turning now, and it began sometime in the 00s, whether with 9/11, Katrina, or the recent economic crisis. And the rise and election of Obama very much rhymes with the rise of FDR in 1932. And we are fighting two wars. Fear is all pervasive. Crime has dropped dramatically since the early 1990s. People respect intelligent people far more than in previous decades, which is also a sign of a 4T. And in the media, the geek genre of entertainment (fantasy, mythology, comics, video games, science fiction) dominate both television and the movies and even literature (something that hasn't happened since the 1930s and 1940s). This suggests that things will continue to get worse and worse, until society reaches a turning point and things get better. So we have several more years of free fall into hell before things begin to improve. Yeah, we won't have to worry about thugs nearly as much as we did in the 1990s. But we will merely replace that worry of crime with that of being killed in some major political strife. And by the mid 2020s, we will have completed the fourth american revolution.

After that comes a first turning. Think of the 1950s. The ultra conformist, ultra paranoid, and security mindedness directly results from society just having endured 20 years of fear, strife, war, economic depression. In the 1950s, the vast catastrophes of the Great Depression, a catastrophic world war, the holocaust, the invention and usage of nuclear weapons, and the extreme racism and nationalism of Hitler, Mussolini, Franco, and Tojo were still fresh in public memory. The happenings of the fourth turning tend to be a vast trauma that casts a shadow over the first turning. Crime is the lowest during this era. Even the most distressed communities tend to be unified with a strong bedrock. This period is the opposite of the third turning. The culture is very bland and the culture is spirit dead. The political machine is actually powerful, and can get things done that couldn't get done in the gridlock of the third turning. Other first turnings in the past include the 1880s and the 1800s decades, and the next major first turning decade should be the 2030s.

And finally, we have the second turning. This is the opposite of the fourth turning. These are periods of spiritual awakening, religious unrest, and cultural revolutions (such as the Chinese Cultural Revolution of the 1960s). While the fourth turning is focused on the outer world (politics, institutions, infrastructure, governance, technology, economics) the second turning is focused on the inner world (culture, spirituality, religion, values, identity, morale). While fourth turnings found nations, second turnings found religions. Society focuses on reforming the culture, and on infusing spirituality into a society that seems soul dead. This is an era of cultural experimentation into sex, drugs, art, and lifestyle. People search for spiritual truths. All of this results in a sudden rise in crime and drugs, as well as mass hysteria. These also tend to be periods of identity search, and periods of divisiveness. It is no coincidence that black power came along when it did. These tend to be periods of ethnic/racial and religious unrest. Other second turnings include the 1890s and 1900s decades (which saw the rise of Jim Crow, white supremacy/identity, religious unrest, NAACP and the black consciousness movement, Greenwich Village, environmentalism, etc.), the 1820s/1830s (the birth period of both white and black nationalism, romanticism, more religious upheaval, bohemianism, etc), and then the Great Awakening of the 1730s and 1740s. The Protestant Reformation is also a second turning. And by the 2050s we will be in a second turning.

 

That's deep Mad....

 

Seriously. I'm interested in reading more.

Had me thinking some crazy stuff.

 

Me too. I have talks about our society with my father who's 82. He's been through so much in his life and seen different changes throughout the decades.

This is kind of a sidebar to what Mad is saying, but I've always felt if we could mix things like values and family structure of yesteryear, with modern idealisms. This would be a better place. It seems like the world is running wild like a child without supervision. Humans crave structure and foundation.

 

Hiphop response.

Hip hop is doing to the youth what blow did to the youth in the late 60's, doing to them what heroin did to folk in the 70's and what crack did to so many in the 80's.I know guys who have stole cassette tapes just to hear ' Fuck tha police " by NWA.I know guys who have committed crimes after listening to Bone Thugs and Harmony.I know girls who were straight A students in middle and high school, but after Trina, thay wanna be tha baddest bitch and like Kira, what ever, they want someone to make them feel it in their neck, their back.I mean it's music put together, packaged, distributed, sold, consumed through the ears, and in many, not all, but in many cases acted out on.Like dope, it's influences.

 

Two posts in and knocking it out the park.

 

We have a generation of fucking morons who can't get that through their paper thin skulls.

 

:smt023

 

You guys are being plain unfair. Yes hip hop isn't turning black youths into scholars but it's not suppose to either. I find it hilarious how we blame music for social problems. Art has always been a reflection of what's going on socially. Pop music also adds to promiscuity and this overtly entitled generation but you don't see white parents blaming Lady Gaga or Britney Spears. The music is an end result not the cause nor the root. No matter what the music promotes it's up to individuals to choose whether or not they will listen and emulate these people who do the music. Even though there are individuals who make money from promoting violence and drug use but I've yet to hear one person protesting as heavy against Slyvester Stalone or Jet Li for doing movies where they rack up on the body count and the crowd cheers for more. No one protested against Johnny Depp for his role as an incredibly successful drug dealer in blow nor did anyone give a rats ass about Al Pacino's role in scarface.
So when black people do it ib rap they're promoting a lifestyle but when white people do it in movies they're just protraying a character no matter how many sequels they do and no matter how of the same movie they do.
It's straight bullshit and you guys need to take a second look. I personally don't like most of the music of today but that's what comes with age. We aren't the target demo of popular music anymore. Our interests aren't clubs and trying to be seen so we're not suppose to really relate to what's popular anymore. If there's any reason why the black youth is spiraling out of control is because there's a lack of parenting. Too many lazy ass people throw their responsibility on someone else's shoulders. We as a culture as a country would never accept someone killing or selling drugs because of movies or tvs so why is it that music has to take the wrap.
Logic!!!!! I dare one of you to beat it

 

Here comes the Hip-Hop Gestapo right on cue hahaha. This shit is not "art," it is contrived, calculated tales of crime and bullshit for impressionable teenagers.

That's white parents' problem. When I look out and see my people going wrong, I will speak on it. Speaking of your example, I see white women being portrayed as vapid, self-absorbed golddiggers through every phase of their lives: "My Super Sweet 16" when their children, "The Bachelor" and "The Hills" when they're in their 20s, and "The Real Housewives" when they're older. But it's up to women to decide whether they've had enough of being shown in that light.

Music is far more important to us as a people than it is to other groups, and we are far more susceptible to its effects. This is the same music we used to communicate so Massa couldn't understand us. Now our formula has been turned against us.

I've heard this argument before, the old "white people do it too" defense. First of all, white folks on the whole seem to be able to distinguish entertainment from life. They don't listen to a record then go out and rob people. If anything, white folks saw "Wall Street" and were inspired to get a fucking job and make real, legal money (and destroy the economy but that's another story). Secondly, white folks aren't judged by their worst, only by their best. And lastly, what they do don't concern me.

That's because whites overall have sense enough not to try to make a lifestyle out of a goddamn movie or a record. When people start dressing like Schwarzenegger and start talking about going to Mars and shooting up people let me know.

If you were actually around before hip-hop, you'd know the difference. This is why increasingly I don't talk to anybody under 35 about anything substantive.

Hahaha, I just did.

 

Yes, we have. Unfortunately there appear to be entirely too many women willing to jump at the chance to reinforce that.

 

Karma again I have to call bullshit. Basically you just said we as black people lack the intelligence to decipher between right and wrong. We as a people are basically so simple that anything we see or hear we have no choice to emulate because of our lack of will power and common sense.
Fuck that!!! I and many of my friends listen to and love hip hop but had parents that made sure our black asses went to school and made something of ourselves. I think the bigger problem was the a fore mentioned drug problem through out the 60s 70s and 80s that's made black neighborhoods into ghettos causing most of the men to be murdered or put in prison at a young age. Hip hop didn't create that, it has become another way for people to make money. And you don't have the right to determine what is art, some people think Van Gough is brilliant or abstract art is a true resemblance of the soul I for one don't understand or like it but its not for me to determine what others should call art there in lies the beauty of it.
I am really appalled at you view us as a people, like we're children incapable of making our own decisions.
You're Mr. Pro African American yet you look down on us like we're a bunch of idiots without minds or reasoning ability.
You're absolutely right when you said white people are judged by their best and we are judged by our worst and you proved that's what you do when you look at us as a people.
Btw the age bashing is lame. You may disagree with my points of view but you're intelligent enough to know that my points have validity.
You keep mixing your personal feelings in and won't look at the data.
My logic still stands solid you haven't debunked anything all you did was reiterate the same tired stereotypes fam.

 

If you say so.

 

Karma do you have kids?

 

hmm. sorry but im with Karma.

and andrea:> try locating yourself in another brothers shoes, and realize that not everybody is as blessed as you. Obviously peole should make their own decision, however what you fail to realize is that kids as young as seven (yes, 7 years old) listen to hip hop. In fact, the majority of those that consider ludacriss and lil wayne as "role models" are either pre teen or slightly older (although its not only them that listen to hip hop)

So yes….. karma gets it

The fact is white people are surrounded by a solid culture (yes America is a culture) infrastructure, architecture and admirable role models. You have all these Nobel prize winners and such for lil white kids to learn about (not every white kid will ever reach that high but still,,its the inspiration that matters) but what exactly is there for black kids? Hip Hop? And its not KRS or even nas thats educating these young minds (through music) but its 50 Cent and Lil wayne ( one a past criminal the other current). The power 50 and Lil Wayne currently possess is assertive enough to push back conscious artists if they want to. It’s a thug take over, plain and simple. Single parent families with young kids selling weed to friends>> that’s reality. A lot of young brothers being shot up in Cali, Philly , Toronto, etc and the music is usually the tool that "pumps" them up, trust me when I say this. The underlying "thugication" of the urbs, the street education etc that hip hop preaches is primarily based on a hustler's disdain for making major moves in no other fashion other than the fast ski mask tactic. Fast cash, telling kids that school is for suckas and instant gratification is the golden rule…… take this shit here and you can get new rims in two weeks

People will say that hip hop is an international culture, it's global. The ability to deliver more ideas is higher in hip hop compared to other music genres. Yes, all that is correct, however as soon as art-form gets corrupted by the wrong hands, its over. You have negativity and ignorance portrayed and yes, most of them reflect the problems in our realities collectively, but never is there ever a solution to these problems. So nothing gets resolved; what we are left with is ignorant blacks and clever whites watching- creating a "blackfaces" over again. Although racism is currently politically incorrect, it still exists. Behind closed doors in mimicking actions (kinda like black face) of black behavior and ignorance and laughing about it behind our backs.

To them its all a big joke. Yeah 50 cent got shot five times and lil wayne is about to do time and T.I just got out of jail. The fact is ,there are over 1 million black men in prison. Drug dealing within the black community is an occupation (job) some white people think the average black man does. Youngsters are sick and tired of living in poverty, so they sell drugs (like their roe models) to make quick cash , so they can drive those big rhims and rock them chains (like their role models). Usually the mother who’s probably on welfare knows that her children are selling drugs just to make a living and does not care. She knows the youngsta is skipping class, but whats an education? She’ll ask.

So basically, to me there is no major conspiracy against the black male. I think it’s the chicken or the egg all over again. That is, did hip hop destroy the black community or did hip hop get created as a result of a broken community? ???...........However the fact still remains>>that during the civil rights [movement] era, there were many (many) mentally strong black male (leaders) than there currently are. As I said earlier, the major leaders of "black" these days are hiphop stars and thats not what the black community requires. We need a major revolution in this bitch

later