Black men vs black men

I decided to post a little research on something I have both a professional and personal investment in. Black men killing black men. Nothing new. And no one seems to really care, especially in the black community. We can rally around the country for tragedies like Travaugn Martin but when it comes to slaughtering ourselves it seems few care. Politicians, preachers, the public at large just doesn’t care…however, since we are visual proof based society (sans some conservatives) I thought it best to present it numerically.

Black men make up about 6% of the population but account for over half the murders. 9 out of 10 killed are murdered by another black man. That means that 7000 black men are murdered each year and 94% are killed by another black man. Between 1976 and 2011 there were 279,384 black murder victims which means about 262,621 were murdered by other blacks according to Bureau of Justice Statistics. Lot of dead “solders” because some black men see such death/pain as a rite of passage or badge of honor….but they may feel this way because in essence both physically, emotionally, mentally even financially, it is a war.

Black Fatalities in Korean War totaled 3075, Vietnam 7243, and all wars since 1980 (I was born in 82) 8197. That comes to 18,515, far from the 6 figure number above and just over twice the yearly average. What’s even more alarming is a study by the Tuskegee institute that’s estimates during the years 1882 and 1968 3,446 black men were lynched by whites, still far from what we do to one another today.

But this is America right? What about other major conflicts in the world…for the sake of argument, lets take out Government interference ie Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, Saddam and just go with mostly civilian populations that slaughter one another. Palestine/Israeli and Irish conflict come to mind. Both have struggles that are around the same 35-40 year period and comparable populations if you are considering only black males. The Irish conflict 1969-2010 cost the lives 3,568 people. The Palestine/Israeli conflict since the war began in 1948 have cost the lives of 14,500, still small in comparison of what black men in this country do to one another.

To call this anything but war is painfully unrealistic, and reality is, most of us are not really doing or saying anything about it. We will rally against great injustice like the Jena 6, Travaugn Martin as mentioned above, and any black person hurt, injured or killed by police or other ethnic groups yet we when we slaughter each other, there is silence and those (like my black ass) that are aberrations and try to alert the community at large to such aversions are shunned and ostracized.

Last year Detroit had 0ver 400 murders, and well over 2000 shootings. What do you call this other than War?





Source of Information
1) Bureau of Justice statistics
2) Tuskegee institute study on lynchings
3) The Negro Holacasust: Lynching and Race Riots in the United States 1880-1950 by Robert A. Gibson
4) Israeli vs Palestine, the Polynational War Memorial-Nov 14, 2012 by Joe Brunberg
5) Malcom Sutton’s Index of Deaths From the Conflict in Ireland: Status summary. Conflict Archive on the Internet (Cain)
6) Gaston Gazette-www.m.globalgrind.com/news

 

I'm not trying to be mean but I am not in Detriot. Detriot needs to clean up its own mess.

 

most of that info is nationwide...7,000 black men murdered each year...it aint just a Detroit problem

 

It is certainly not an archangel problem. You have so many people on this planet. You can not possibly correct all the bad behaviors in them. for every one you fixed, there are probably two more broken. To make it even worse, you have your problems.

 

This is a moot point because I'm sure the same can be said of any group. How many whites murder whites or hispanics murder hispanics. Why are blacks suppose to be different?

 

This was going to be my first point in my first post but I decided to just go along with it. If you strip the race from all these people, the numbers would not change.

 

who murders at our rate? again...we make up 6% of the population but half the murders?


I know in our culture it is not popular to self reflect much but I thought at least here it could be a conversation.lol..

 

Interesting point well riddle me this why are we three to four times as likely to be unemployed. When you look at the crime statistics that seem to represent "our" group its akin to the disenfranchised across the globe regardless of race. If you are systematically marginalized economically depressed/oppressed, and socially demonized you tend to lash out more and have less respect for life as well as others. But to be fair the crimes committed only represent a small fraction of us as a group yet its all people focus on. The majority of rapes and child molestations are committed by white men but no one feels the need to address them as a group and figure out why white men are doing their dirt.

 

To be quite honest, TDK has a point on the oppression. If you look at those stats, you will probably see a low education. You will also see that opportunities for a higher education have not been given to those individuals. In some cases, because of race and other cases because of finance. Yet, we are happy to point to the symptoms instead of the actual cause of the problem.

 

:smt010

Don't mean to put you on the spot, since it sounds like you've been through so much already!

But anyway, you've dug up all these stats and done all this work to save us, so please grace us with your solution... :?:

 

Well gentlemen that’s all I was looking for… just a conversation.
The low education, oppression are all valid points. And for the record....no group has the monopoly on rape/child molestation....that’s something that men...ironically mostly heterosexual men do to women, children both boys and girls.

However in our culture the violence seems to be either almost celebrated (music, magazine, tv)....or blown off and ignored. I was curious to find other view points as to why? We rise up to shout against what happened to Travon Martin or the Jena 6 but little is done when we kill each other….would love to know other points of why we do that as well….

And non black people welcome to chime in.....this is a crime against humanity.

 

I'd rep these posts, but it says I gotta spread it around first.

Good posts - always slicing through the bullshit, getting right to the heart of the matter

:smt023

 

Personally I think situations like the TM incident gets the attention it does because one it shows that killing a black person comes with no consequence when someone of another race does it. The way the police handled it was disgusting to say the least.

 

Agreed...the way Sanford handled that was atrocious.

I dont have any solutions...not short term anyway. But I would start with education...something that has been mentioned here couple times....problem is....how do you get those stuck in ignorance and inertia to care...you cant. But we can put money into public education to save their children. Just a start....we could also just sue the US education dept for never really enforcing Brown vs Board of Education. but thats a long shot. all of it is really

 

They have been taking out public money from the education system for a while and at the same time the schools have been raising cost. I've been looking recently for a program and the prices are not too friendly.:smt012

 

angel check out 2009 Mckinley report.....has some interesting info.....
I think its a crime personally to rob tax payers and the education system...but we have been doing it for over 40 years now

 

Now, that's a good point. I think it all has to do with the system of cultural values (or lack thereof).

What you're seeing is a culture of young men establishing their own values without much guidance from earlier generations or pretty much anyone, except maybe all the big men with guns in the movies and shit, and the fools pushing guns and violence and "bad man" ism in our music.

My theory - it's the typical testosterone-driven teen swagger, minus the constraints of any other cultural values, plus the absence of any other avenues to peer-group status. Other young men have the same instincts, but they also have cultures to temper those testosterone driven instincts, plus other credible avenues for status.

It's just cultural values that have grown all out of hand into something warped.

In india, there's a tribe that worships rats, has a temple full of them, feeds them and shit, because they think they're their ancestors reincarnated or something. And just the other day salafist muslims in nigeria killed a schoolroom full of kids, set it ablaze and shot the ones that ran out of the fire, in their war to establish sharia in the country. Same shit happens in Pakistan, suicide bombings every other day. And right here in america, white bikers kill each other over who can wear the state name in the the bottom rocker. And mexs too kill each other over red vs. blue. And some guys fuck their wives through a little hole in the sheet, and their wives are forbidden to show their hair, but instead wear wigs :mrgreen:

My point? Culture (cultural values) can take you in some strange, strange directions, including shit like thinking you've "hit the big time" when you've caught a bid in state prison. Congrats, mr "gangsta," you've made it! :mrgreen:

You see, an important function of culture is so that people who aren't much for thinking know how to comport themselves. Not too bright? (just like most people of whatever culture?) Not too worldly? Then you're going to follow your cultural values in your little pond, and that's that. Get it?

Okay - wanna solve shit? Here's my stab: Draft our most talented artists - moviemakers and musicians especially, to do a little (subtle, slick, non-highhorse-preachy) "social engineering", and change the cultural values. Give these guys something else to be... And work on the women too, so they reward the right things.

Draft the comedians too! being ridiculed and laughed at changes idiotic behavior with a swiftness.

Music is a key to black culture. It's the only thing we have that can compare to and has as much "cred" as hollywood... See the way it has echoed around the world in past generations (though I worry for the future of it).

Writers and comedians egg on and inspire the music folks, who egg on and inspire the common folks - like that. Call them on their shit, like that chimp the motherfuckin p.i.m.p. what's his name... Like that.

Change the cultural values. give them some other choices than being the idiot gangsta shooting up mothers' day celebrations or the stiff tight-suited corporate monkey eating shit from spiteful combovers every day

Come up with other images and avenues and more productive values. Spread them slickly and wed them to status. Cultures are alive and evolve. It can be done

That's my take. And avoid stupid shit like rubbing all our noses in negative images in an effort to save us. I think the kkk is trying to save us the same way.. :mrgreen:

Black men are not just idiots, your own example supposedly being proof positive. If you're so great, you can do better than focusing on gloom and doom statistics and impotence in the face of it.

:smt018

 

hmmm...so I think black men are idiots??? my intent was never to "attack" black men...or even us as a whole culture....what annoyed me the most was how much some of “US” complain about racism, discrimination but say little about the violence in-house...so really a sub-culture

Perhaps I struck a nerve with some giving the slight personal attacks which I won’t defend. The autonomy of the internet/arguing is just silly. I joined the site because it seemed to be full of and welcoming of intellectual ferment…something not easy to find…especially with other men. And especially black men. But I guess I said the wrong things or said something the wrong way or hit a nerve or some shit. So I am done with it all.

I will say that many of you once you stopped attacking the original thoughts and post came up with some great ideas, a few which I have pondered myself.

 

Thanks a lot fam. I appreciate it

 

Which is why you need to continue to contribute, despite the way this thread has evolved. This forum has been too full of porn, arguing, bashing, etc. We need intellectual conversation!!! I'm actually surprised at the response you got here, especially from TDK, as he tends to like to discuss issues that BM face and struggle with. Being in law enforcement, I have to think you see this particular problem on the regular. I saw this thread as a request to openly (and intelligently) discuss something that troubles you rather than just another doom and gloom portrait of BM. Thankfully, Medulla took a stab at a solution which I appreciated.

There's no reason that these things can't be discussed if done with the right intent and respectfully. Too often, from what I've observed, some seem to want to paint BM in a negative light out of disgust or shame, rather than an honest attempt to discuss reasons for or solutions to a problem.