Anyone a traditionalist and a bit irritated by the secularism in current society?

Don't get me wrong. I don't inherently believe religion is needed to derive morals. I would consider myself a non-secular humanist. Raised Catholic, I can concede that there are things as a human I am unable to understand, or rather I am limited by my own world view that I cannot comprehend things that might be anomalies or supernatural in this universe.

I will say though that I can determine truth and falsehood as much and I strive to live my life as the best person possible. I believe it is arrogant to believe that we are the highest form of being and maybe my view of God should be more of Deism, where he created this universe and that's it.

IDK what irks me, it just seems that some people in society just do what 'feels good' and think about the consequences later. This #yolo generation, feminism, you have these angry teens growing up that are atheists (moreso anti Christian, not anti religion) who are pissed because mommy and daddy took them to Church too many times or the philosophical potheads/druggies who are spawned out of this. Hypersensitive generation. People don't want to be judged for their actions or pay for the consequences of them. Shit is just irking me because our society seems pacified because of all of this.

I'm not perfect I won't say, just observing things in society right now.

Society is just a social experiment it seems and I think we are slowly teetering towards the wrong end. All societies have fallen.

 

repped

 

Thanks man. An example I can give is during this whole Chick Fil A thing. How the media attacked the CEO of Chick Fil A about his beliefs (which were derived from Christianity and HIS own beliefs).

Did he make anti-gay comments? Did he make a 'gay-only' menu that served hotdogs or fired all his gay employees? No, but the media vilified him and made him look bad.

Not that I agree with his concept of marriage, but he should still be entitled to his beliefs. That's the beauty of society, but it seems like it was more on 'I agree with everything, except what I disagree with'.

 

No more comments?

 

I think everyone is entitled to their own beliefs up until the point where they seek to exclude those who differ with them from full participation in society, be it in housing, employment or other rights/privileges. On the gay marriage question, I am fully in support of people having the right to define the sort of domestic situation that works for them, provided it is agreed to freely, not forced on someone by elders, siblings, etc.

The better response would be for the government to amend all bills so that the term "marriage" is changed to "contract of civil union or other state-sanctioned domestic arrangement". Then they could let individual religious institutions decide what types of relationships they choose to sanction without denying people full access to equal protection under the law due their sexual orientation.

 

Agreed

 

WTF does feminism have to do with any if the rest of that? I've been an active feminist since I was a young teenager, and it has nothing to do with the rest of what you're getting at here. Can you clarify your inclusion?

 

whats dangerous about a country that says "this country needs to follow G-d. get back to what the founding fathers based this country on"

1) which G-d
2) then lets trash the constitution because we are looking at a theocrasy
3) the founding fathers hated G-d.

 

I love how the right has transformed these internationalist French, Latin and Dutch-speaking intellectual Deist and Masonic slaveholders, into Christian fundamentalist, English-only, freedom lovers. Talking about radical makeovers.

 

they used the bible to commit evil acts and / or they just lived in a culture of evil

 

Indeed. Though I have to give a shout out to my boy John Adams, who found the idea of slavery appalling. But even he, who was more traditionally Christian than a lot of the founders, was a Unitarian.

Because of my adoration of history and my reverence for the foundational documents of this nation, the nauseating twists and tucks the right makes in our history, particularly David Barton (whose take on the founders should put him in jail for libel and slander), is the thing the right wing does which gets my dander up the most. The rest of their bullshit, I expect. But dropping the constitution and the writings of the founders in a blender and hitting purée ought to be illegal

 

Glad I'm inciting comments now. I have no problem with traditional feminism. Modern feminism alongside what is occurring in our society is what bothers me. It is less about being equal with men and more about getting what the court systems and society allows. Women are victims yada yada. I'm all for equality though.

The founding fathers were Deists more than anything.

And yes goes both ways. I'm more of a moderate. Just maybe I'm getting old and some changes in society I don't like lol.

 

so there was never a time in this country that had a following for god

 

Actually, I've been active in feminism for, well since I was 14. You do the math. Feminism has not changed its aims, except that it's much more aware of the problems of intersectionality (I.e women of color, disabled woman, queer women, trans women) than it used to be. If you think it has, you're reading hype.

 

I'm not reading hype when the divorce laws favor women in divorce because there is an assumption that all men are deadbeats or something and women need these extra rights to protect them. That isn't about equality at that point.

The post-feminism society has spawned a men's right movement to counter this though.

 

Do you actually read the spew age from the real MRAs? The MGTOW too?

I can pull this one from memory. In MA where I got divorced 70% of men who file for sole custody get it. Most men don't even file for it.

 

Ha I thought you'd say I got it from that board. Really from other sources of information. Not just divorce laws, but how men are viewed in society in other aspects e.g violence against men seen as comical vs violence against women much more serious..and for good reason in some instances.

I'm not a woman hater by no means, just a proponent of equal rights for ALL. Also, the instances in which divorce is initiated, it is 90% initiated by women.

 

Examples

# Women are allowed to marry at younger ages than men in some U.S. states.

# Men pay higher premiums for auto, life and disability insurance, though discrimination according to race or other criteria is prohibited.

# Increasing suicide rate among young men, four times higher than among young women.

# Prostate cancer funding disproportionately lower than breast cancer funding.

# Incarceration for not paying child support, particularly for unwanted children, in contrast to women's right to abort.

# Violence against men minimalized or taken less seriously than violence against women.

# Women are more violent than men in some research studies asking both men and women.

# Assumption of female innocence or sympathy for women, which may result in problems such as disproportionate penalties for men and women for similar crimes, lack of sympathy for male victims in domestic violence cases, and dismissal of female-on-male rape cases.

# Depiction of violence against men as humorous, in the media and elsewhere (see Boys are stupid, throw rocks at them!), when women are also violent.

# Discrimination with regard to child custody.

# Unfairness in the way the alimony and child support systems are structured.

# Statutory rape laws enforced more vehemently in instances where the victim is female and/or the perpetrator is male.

# Rape shield laws, which may prevent some men from adequately challenging their accuser.

# Societal failure to address prison rape, including issues such as prevention (e.g., reducing prison crowding that requires sharing of cells), impunity for prison rapists, and even correctional staff punishing prisoners by confining them with known rapists. Prison rape is often used as a subject of humor in films such as Let's Go to Prison.


Even the way men are treated in commercials nowawdays as helpless morons

This isn't taking rights away from women. Not at all, but rather make AWARE of the injustices men face in our courts now.

 

You apparently missed what I said about child custody. Insurance rates aren't set by law, they're set by actuaries, based on risk. Europe, btw is starting to change that, as always we are behind. The biggest thing we can do to help prisons is stop busting people for possession, followed by getting the prison industrial complex out of business and turning that back over to the government. Statutory rape laws and the age to marry should be the same for all. It's our societal propensity to see women as lesser actors in their own lives which led to those laws. Violence is never funny. I don't know a single guy who has been locked up for non-payment of support, but statistics say less than a 1/4 of single parents of any gender receive the full amount of child support payments. Not rocket science. That's wrong no matter the gender of the parent. If we didnt live in a rape culture, rape victims would not be seen as 'broken' and their past sexual histories wouldn't be at issue in the first place, which is why rape shield laws were put in place.

Prison rape needs to be addressed, and seriously. The BS info about women being just as violent as men is just that, BS. It's belied by the violent crime statistics in this country and around the world. The BEST thing any guy can do about violence against men is to work toward a society where that aggressiveness is better channeled. Men are overwhelmingly more violent that women, and that DOES need addressing. Sometimes women are the victims and sometimes men are, but the root is the same, male violence. That isn't to say that some individual women aren't violent because they are. But there is overwhelming acceptance of male on male and male on female violence, which starts with two little boys knocking the crap out of each other on the playground. Violence is never the right answer.

As for abortion, you're comparing apples and oranges. Every time a woman goes through a pregnancy she is putting her life potentially at risk. It's up to her to decide what to do about abortion. That one is inviolate with me.

Pardon the lack of formatting or if I missed something here, the iPad really hates the forums. It types about five words behind where I am and scrolling back is a major pain. I haven't figured out why yet, it doesn't do that anywhere else (though autocorrect and other things are a constant problem, but it lets me lie down and stay off my back when I'm online)

 

Which doesn't change the custody stats. Even if the woman wants out, the man can still file for full custody and get it more than half the time. Most men don't bother. The courts are, in most states overwhelmingly supportive of joint custody to the point where it is now the default. So fight for your kids!