AZ - right to refuse service

three steps forward and four steps back...SERIOUSLY!! this is just crazy...


PHOENIX - Four years after igniting a national uproar over immigration, the Arizona Legislature has jumped into the battle over gay rights with a piece of legislation that had opponents on Friday predicting business boycotts against the state.

The legislation allows business owners with strongly held religious beliefs to refuse service to gays, and all eyes are on Republican Gov. Jan Brewer as she decides whether to sign the bill. A decision is likely next week.

The conservative governor is already feeling pressure from the business community to veto the bill passed late Thursday. A prominent Phoenix group believes it would be another black eye for the state that saw a national backlash over its 2010 immigration crackdown law, SB1070. Opponents also pointed out that the legislation would serve as a major distraction as Arizona prepares to host the Super Bowl next year.

But Brewer also will be heavily pressured to sign the bill by social conservatives who backed it as a religious-rights bill.

Brewer, who is deeply religious but also pro-business, is caught somewhere in the middle. She hasn't taken a public position on this bill.
Social conservatives and libertarian-minded members of the GOP believe the legislation protects the First Amendment rights of business owners who are expressing their religious beliefs.
The new legislation was passed over the objections of Democrats who said it was clearly designed to allow discrimination against gays. All but three Republicans in the Legislature voted in favor of the bill.

Greater Phoenix Economic Council President and CEO Barry Broome urged the governor to veto the bill and said four companies have already put their plans to open facilities in Arizona on hold until they see if the bill becomes law. The impact could mean the potential loss of "thousands of jobs," Broome said.
He arizlegislature.jpg
Republican Eddie Farnsworth speaks in support of the bill that expands the rights of people to assert their religious beliefs in refusing service to gays and others at the Arizona State Capitol on Thursday, Feb. 20, 2014, in Phoenix, Ariz. (AP Photo/The Arizona Republic, Stacie Scott)
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Stacie Scott, AP
told CBS affiliate KPHO the bill would send the wrong message to companies looking to come to Arizona.
"So much of the cultural transformation going on in America right now is toward acceptance and tolerance," said Broome. "I think it's going to be very difficult to attract any kind of talent or investment or events. It's going to destroy the goodwill between our state and the rest of the world."

Debbie Johnson, president of the Valley Hotel and Resort Association, told KPHO that if the governor signs the measure, it could jeopardize the prospects of Arizona getting another Super Bowl or any other major event.

"We're already hearing from dozens and dozens of people," said Johnson. "They are emailing us and convention bureaus and the office of tourism telling us they're not coming to Arizona, because we don't want to come to a state that is not welcoming."

Republicans defended the proposal during two days of debate in the House and Senate, saying the bill is only a "modest update" of the state's existing religious freedom law, which mirrors existing federal legislation. They frequently cited the case of a New Mexico photographer who was sued after refusing to take wedding pictures of a gay couple and said Arizona needs a law to protect people in the state from heavy-handed actions by courts.

"The world's on its ear," said Rep. John Allen, R-Scottsdale, who supported the bill. "It's alien to me that a business owner can't reflect his faith in his business."

The bill allows any business, church or person to cite the law as a defense in any action brought by the government or an individual claiming discrimination. It also allows the business or person to seek an injunction once they show their actions are based on a sincere religious belief and the claim places a burden on the exercise of their religion.

Arizona is one of several states with religious freedom laws on the books, and the proposal in question would expand the act in ways that supporters say do not amount to radical revisions.

The ultimate fate of the bill will be clear sometime next week. Brewer will have five days after her office receives the bill to act, and it likely won't reach her desk until Monday.

She did veto similar legislation last year, but that came during a bill-signing moratorium she put in place while she battled to get recalcitrant conservatives in the Legislature to pass a Medicaid expansion. Still, the veto might be a hint that she won't go along again. And she's knocked down other controversial bills, including a 2011 bill that would have required President Barack Obama and other presidential candidates to prove their U.S. citizenship before their names could appear on the state's ballot.

Rep. Demion Clinco, a Tucson Democrat who is openly gay, called the bill "toxic" and said it will validate attacks on gays and lesbians.

"It actually creates some sort of credibility to be able to tell someone 'I'm sorry, I can't serve you in my restaurant or my place of business or provide you services because you're different or because of your sexuality,'" Clinco said.

Josh Kredit, an attorney for the Center of Arizona Policy which helped draft the legislation, said it wouldn't add any new substantive legal rights for business owners.

"We are clarifying the protection we thought existed. We're not saying you have carte blanche to do whatever you want," Kredit said.

Religious groups were split. Kredit's group is evangelical Christian, and the Arizona Catholic Conference backs the bill. The Episcopal Diocese of Arizona opposes it.

About 250 protesters gathered outside the state capitol Friday, holding signs with messages such as "This is Ridiculous" and "What About Love Thy Neighbor?" Another protest was planned in Tucson, where a march to Brewer's southern Arizona office was planned.

Meanwhile, Republican Secretary of State Ken Bennett issued a statement calling the bill "an unnecessary measure to protect a God-given right already assured by the Constitution."

After hearing that the legislation was approved, Rocco DiGrazia, owner of Rocco's Little Chicago Pizzeria in Tucson, put up a sign on a window Thursday night that reads "We reserve the right to refuse service to Arizona legislators."

DiGrazia calls the bill's approval "appalling."

DiGrazia, who grew up Catholic but doesn't follow any religion now, said he cares more about dishing out pizza to customers - gay or straight. He isn't sure if he'll follow what's on his sign.

 

What is the point of discrimination laws if they are knocked to the floor with some next law.

It stinks and is such bad and I mean bad business, imagine being so foolish as to eliminate a whole demographic of customers from your business.:smt118

 

It's business they don't want. It's not so much because they are gay in and of itself, as it is what they want them to do. Their lo$$. I recall a Christian Bakery declining to bake a gay-themed wedding cake for 2 gay men, who specifically sought out this bakery to do it. So they sued the bakery....

 

We have some crazy stuff going on here with M&S (Marks and Spencer) allowing their Muslim staff to refuse to sell alcohol and making a customer wait for an appropriate member of staff to serve them.

Personally shopping is not a fun experience and if someone made me wait to be served even longer, I would walk out and leave the whole trolley behind.
(Obviously not good business)

There are limits to everyone's tolerance to religious infringement on consumers if somewhere sells alcohol, I expect the employees to be able to sell the alcohol.

Same for cakes, if you make cakes to order in the customers own design, then whatever design needed should not matter.
Otherwise you best market your cake business with set designs only.


The only time I would fall on the side of religion is if someone wanted to be married in a church or temple for a religion that is anti gay marriage/relationships.
Every religion deserves it's own space to practice.
Although I'm not sure many gay people would want to marry in a church that was hostile to there way of life anyway.

 

the bakery brought that on themselves.

 

Why would what someone does in the privacy of their homes or bedroom have a damn thing to do with a business giving them service??

And how the hell is a business owner going to know if someone is gay??

Such a stupid bill to even get voted on by other adults.

I'm really sick and tired of people hiding behind their 'religion' as an excuse to be bigoted.

What happened to all that 'love the sinner, hate the sin' stuff Bible thumpers talk about??

Isn't the law unconstitutional anyway??

 

Well said.

It would be like a jeweler not making/designing or selling rings or necklace/jewelery because the couple buying it is gay..so stupid for business. We still have private golf clubs here that exclude women.

I think in the case of the photographer, it's his business and has the right of refusal, he doesn't have to record it if it didn't sit well with him, his loss though. Anyway, they should have given the business to another who would, or even a gay photographer.

 

A business serves the public regardless and it is not a religious institution. It is discrimination pure and simple.

 

Interesting it seems that equality laws here are quite complex, in theory a golf club could be one sex only if it is just a membership fee, but if it acts in the way an association works ie there are over 25 members and membership has to be approved by some kind of body, then no they aren't allowed to be same sex.
But if they open the club to non paying members ie competitions or a cafe then they are a service provider and the rules bite them in the backside again anyway.
Including disability right to access the whole hog.

 

Waiting for someone to get the courage to put up a sign "Whites Only".

You know its coming.

 

this sign is in the window @rocco's pizzeria in tuscon

 

America stays on some bullshit regarding the language of it own Constitution.

 

This is your funny for the day, I see. :smt043:smt043

The Constitution stopped being what this country stands for a long time ago.

They may as well just tear it up now, for the good it's doing us.

 

When I flew to Alabama I saw two corner stores with those signs.

 

Are you serious. Wtf is wrong with people? Wow

 

:smt043:smt045

First thing I thought when I heard that utter nonsense in Arizona.

"I don't believe in interracial relations so I shouldn't have to provide service to them."

 

In Alabama who would have thunk it.

 

You should have gotten a picture of it.

 

If they can't refuse you service legally,they'll find some excuse to do it regardless. If an establishment doesn't want your business,then go somewhere else that does.

 

Heaven knows what those black folks ate at the Deli counters in the South, something tells me they were served more than a plate of Southern food.

Probably had spit, piss and all other assorted things in it when they had to eventually serve blacks legally. I shudder to think what was eaten.