No one's talking about Steubenville?

Indeed they do, and this is a problem all over the country. I have a feeling BB would agree with enthusiastic consent as a bottom line for sexual participation.

 

Sometimes theres buyers remorse where a yes becomes a no that she felt weird saying. I just dont like the read my mind game. If we are in this together communicate your feeligs and dont make m completely responsible. We are equals. Btw please stop saying we need to teach young boys not to rape as if not mentioned men are just inclined to do so. The vast majprity of men neither have the stomach or inclination for rape

 

What I'm getting at is that we have an attitude that sex is something men take from women. "Giving it up," etc. We need to teach kids that sex is something people do together, not something one 'gets' from another. We need to teach young men that badgering someone or tricking someone into sex isn't cool. And don't tell me that isn't an attitude a lot of young men have - the whole PUA world is designed around that theory.

You aren't responsible for what your partner answers when you ask, but you ARE responsible for asking. That cuts both ways - enthusiastic consent isn't just limited to one gender. You say that women should learn to exercise caution - to accept less freedom in the world because men rape. How is that any different than saying we need to teach enthusiastic consent? Well, for starters, it doesn't limit the world that women are 'allowed' to live in. In the US, it is said that 6% of men have raped (a South African survey reported that 37% of men admitted raping someone, which I found shocking). Six percent still means that a small but significant proportion of men are NOT getting the message that respect is unacceptable. I think it's better to teach them that than to expect 100% of women to limit their lives in ways men are not expected to do, and which will not protect them anyway. The difference between a woman who is raped and one who is not is the presence of a rapist.

 

You dont have to teach men not to rape since the vast majority have no desire to do it. Those who do rape usually have something mentally wrong with them. Forcing yourself on someone isnt sexy. Also let me add asking a woman of shes down for sex has always been akin with asking if its alright to kiss them. Most women in my experience find that to be a big turn off and it kills the mood. Most women in my experience find non verbal communocation and paying attention to body language to be sexy. So if a woman isnt in to it just say so just say no thank you I am not comfortable aith this. Most men will back off most men dont find makinf a woman uncomfortable sexy at all. Im not saying women have to accept the possibilty of rape but need to be aware of it to better protect themselves.Relying on "educating" men not to do it wont save them from potential assholes who just have something wrong with them.

 

I guess in a culture where 6% of men rape, I think there is something wrong with the society, not just the individual men. But often people who think its women's job to protect themselves from rape seem to be implying that all men are potential rapists, and I don't think that's true at all. You are correct that most men have no interest in sex with someone who doesn't want to be with them. But since most rapes are by loved ones, friends or acquaintances, protecting oneself against stranger rape is not very effective. :/

 

I would wager in those situations that those men are either crazy or suffering from some type of ptsd. Its not a matter of education, most men cringe at the sight of a woman crying let alone enduring the horror of rape. Theres something instinctual in most of us that doesnt get turned on by the suffering of another. So I dont see how educating us not to do it will stop it

 

Well, telling women they can't drink,or go out at night, or to avoid strangers doesnt stop it. In fact education has lowered the rate of rape over the last few decades. RAINN asserts that from 2000–2005, 59% of rapes were not reported to law enforcement.[33][34] One factor relating to this is the misconception that most rapes are committed by strangers.[35] According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, 38% of victims were raped by a friend or acquaintance, 28% by "an intimate" and 7% by another relative, and 26% were committed by a stranger to the victim. About four out of ten sexual assaults take place at the victim's own home.[36]

So how do we fix it, if rapists are, 74% of the time, known to the victim, and 40% take place in the victims home? Avoiding alcohol and strangers isnt going to even make a dent.

 

Never said dont go out a nighr just be smart when you. Dont rely on someone elses good nature to keep you safe.
And again the stats you keep listing can either be attributed to either some break with reality or fucked wiring. Its not like the vast majority of men dont know its wrong. They dont need to be told its wrong. Just like murder, no one needs to tell an adult taking another persons life is wrong

 

True. But it's still the case that a significant minority think its ok, so the message isn't getting across. If it were some insignificant number, I might agree. But six out of every hundred guys in the US? That's more than can be attributed to crazy wiring or psychosis. It's the same as overlooking that most 'crazed gunmen' are white guys. There's something going on there.

 

What some of you are not realizing is rape is not enacted to get your rocks off, it is used as a weapon and form of control over another person.

As crazy as this may sound, men are raped also. Nobody has accurate numbers because men do not report it because of fear of being riducled. And I'm not talking about a woman forcing herself on a man. Men are raped by other men similar to the situation in the original post and other scenarios.

Women along with men have to be more responsible and alert to their surroundings regardless of where they are.

 

Yes, men are raped too. I have a couple of male friends who have had this happen in their younger days, and one who is an out gay man and a celebrity who went to jail on a driving under the influence charge and Was raped so badly he required surgery to repair the damage. It's estimated that about 90% of rape victims are male. 99% of rape perpetrators are men.

Rape is a crime of power and control, it's rarely about sex per se, which is why chemical castration doesn't work as a punishment. The rapist will just find another weapon. In the gang rape in India where the woman died, what did the most damage to her was not penises. She was also raped with a metal rod, and that's what caused the damage to her intestines which required that they be removed.

The only part of your post I take issue with, and it isn't so much an issue as it is to mate a note - 74% of rapes are by a friend, loved one or family member, and 40% of rapes happen in the victim's home. While its always a good idea to be aware of your surroundings, even preventing all stranger rapes would hardly makea dent in the figures. As I was trying to get at earlier,I think there is something wrong when 6% of men are rapists, and when their targets are so often people they should never dream of hurting. There is something about how we teach men about power & control that is going very wrong. Which is NOT to say that all men are potential rapists eithe, but I don't think you can dismiss it with 'dude's fucked up,' unless you think 6% of men are just broken. If we are turning out that many broken men, something is amiss.

 

This whole post says basically everything that needs to be said regarding rape.
With that said..
I would also like to add that being aware of your surroundings can only go so far because that has to do with strangers raping a stranger.

A lot more rapes are commited by people who know the victim and in most situations the person who gets raped feels no reason to be on guard because it's not something that crosses your mind if you are comfortable around the date rapist.

 

6% of American men or men world wide? How many men are diagnosed with a mental illness?
I also think there is something wrong with the way we teach everyone about power and happiness but I still don't see how learned behavior plays a part since most men don't believe forcing themselves on anyone is fun. I really have a hard time seeing that connection

 

Six percent of American men. In South Africa, 37% admitted to having raped a woman. I think that was in the stats I posted this weekend.

 

6% sounds pretty high but considering how many mentally people we have in this country I'm not surprised. Also if you think about it considering the culture that you believe is responsible for that kind of behavior 6 percent is pretty low.

 

I do not believe the vast majority of rapists are mentally ill by the proper definition. They certainly can tell right from wrong. If they were mentally ill, that would be used in defense at trial. I understand that you don't get how someone NOT mentally ill could rape, just like I think anyone who murders is nuts. But the truth is that people committing those crimes are more often perfectly sane.

 

And they might not be mentally ill in the classical sense but their brains are different, they are definitely wired differently. Most people who commit sexual crimes have something missing up there.
I just can't see the logical leap for a person to consciously force someone to have sex with them and think its ok behavior especially in a society where its so frowned upon.
If it were like certain parts of Africa where cultural and religious norms make rape socially acceptable then I would support your argument for re-education but knowing how rapist are treated in society and more importantly in prison I really believe something has to be wrong with you mentally for you to go forward with that shit.

 

Look up Paul Ryan on politicususa.com. rapists don't have enough rights.

Can't post link on this device.

 

There you go buddy
http://www.politicususa.com/paul-ryan-protects-rapists-rights-fetus-bill.html

 

The rapes that are committed by strangers are survey done by mentally screwed up peopl but you are missing the point that the vast majority of rapes are done by well known friends and relatives and for the vast majority of times obviously not done by a mentally messed up person but for other reasons, such as this case, revenge, control and dominance. Most rapists simply just have effed up views of women and most likely, the mentality that this is OK is helping this behavior, that this case clearly shows, including both women and men in significant positions, looking the other way. We could with education that this is not accepted, lower the 6% rate significantly. Unfortunately, archaic views if women do still exist. I applaude you for not getting that, its a good thing. Actually.

These men probably didn't even get that what they did was kidnapping and rape and very serious crimes. They felt entitled and was never reprimanded in the passed, that just reinforces their entitlement and that they were above the law with being protected as it were. The local system created these monsters by looking the other way. Had the legal and school force done their job, this would not happen. They took the money as more important that these heinous crimes by probably writing it off as 'boys will be boys' bs and even taking part in the images (that dude is clearly mentally deranged) , thus these monsters with screwed up views of women and their own importance was created. They were taught it was ok. Otherwise, I bet most of them would be just normal kids. Its horrifying what the local system created here and should serve as a perfect example of how this could have been avoided with the correct teachings and appropriate actions.