OFFICIAL Ask An Atheist Thread!

She replied back with this....maybe she just wants to see my viewpoint?

Not sure what this means exactly.

 

From the sound of things, she's basically trying to rationalize a belief system which includes a lot of absurdities. And much of what she said is pure fluff. You might have to use the Epicurean quote relating to god and evil and see what she has to say about that. I guarantee you that her response won't work well at all. All it will reinforce is that this personal God she worships is merely the conscience of many men who knew how to control people.

 

Where does compassion come from?
The need to help others that are worst off than us?

Other animals only seem to have the instinct for self preservation at all cost but where does the intention, the instinct, the need to help others come from.
If we aren't spiritual beings then shouldn't we be able to ignore the suffering of others?
What consequence is it of mine to recognize the cries of hunger of a baby or even a family thousands of miles away from me?
Where does my need for justice and retribution come from if I am no more than a biological being who's only concern is survival and the furthering of my own dominance?

 

Human emotions all derive from the brain. The triggers vary from person to person. That's pretty much common knowledge. Spirituality holds ZERO relevance to emotions and how we function individually. There are aspects of instinct in us as well.

The best example I could give you is that while it's true we all act on certain forms of prejudice, the main thing you have to recognize is that there's an element of relatedness as a whole. It's common among all of us because those who are closest to us is where our emotions are driven at the highest peak. This also applies to non-human animals.

 

But from an evolutionary stand point what purpose does the idea of protection of another serve?
Protecting ones family or self I get but the willingness to run out into a busy street to save a child or a good samaritan who walks into a burning building to save a family he doesn't know.
I get that we can feel pity but the compassion to risks ones own well being or even using time that could be spent acquiring things for one's self fulfillment seems to go against the very basic instinct of self preservation.
Why do we have people who choose professions like fireman or coast guards or army medical doctors. The pay isn't worth the risk to ones life so why do people choose professions like this. These aren't occupations of desperation, they require intense mental and physical training with little pay yet people choose them.
Sometimes I just wonder if my basic instinct above all others is to survive and to preserve myself and offspring then why is there thought or even time spent on caring for others.

I'm not asserting any particular argument just something I was thinking about.

 

I've already answered your question in the previous post. Read it over again.

 

I read through all the threads and I found your response to artistic expression but nothing on humans putting themselves in harms way with very little to nothing to gain from it.
It doesn't promote preservation or survival.

 

Then you're not paying attention at all. The answers you're looking for are found in understanding altruism. You can start there and read more into it. The answers you're looking for are the basics.

 

There was nothing you wrote in this thread to support the idea of altruism but it is interesting. So basically life supports life and feeds on life at the same time.
I'm going to have to read up on it a lot more because I understand protecting those in one's group or even of one's species but to recognize the suffering of another animal and to help it is interesting. What do we gain?

 

What do we gain? The answer's obvious.

 

Does this mean dogs need Jesus too?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofpYRITtLSg&feature=channel_video_title

 

I don't know about needing Jesus but are they spiritual beings? I believe so.

 

Well you just said here that other animals basically have no interest in doing what I just showed you. Now you are saying they are spiritual? Whatever spiritual is supposed to mean. Are we moving the goalpost?

 

No not at all. You didn't make the context clear in the last post. All you said was do dogs need Jesus. I had no clue what you were talking about.
Dogs usually have to be trained at least to my knowledge but if its true of other animals to help others, more specifically mammals helping mammals, then that shows me that we are more than just biological creatures who's only instinct is to survive, who's only motivation is self preservation and procreation.
In the fight for survival and to just be here I don't see how risking ones own well being fits into that. I know BBW would say that it triggers pleasure zones in the brain but WHY? What is the evolutionary or biological advantage to that?

 

Because apparently humans were the only beings capable of helping others in trouble remember? So if we are not the only spiritual beings, maybe dogs do need Jesus? Mind you i was being sarcastic with that.

Of course humans and other animals are much more complex than just trying to eat and survive, and again that has a natural explanation that has already been explained to you. Although i have a feeling you won't accept anything less than "God did it."

Have you ever seen ants form a raft in water? Do you know why they do that and risk their lives and many of them die? It's a much bigger picture than just the individual, it's more about the species as a whole. I guess ants are spiritual too? The survival of ones own kind and working together is a definite advantage to evolution, which by the way is an indisputable fact.

 

Fine lets say I accept your assertion that we recognize the survival of the species is more important than the survival of the self. Then why do animals like dolphins rescue drowning at sea. Or why do we swerve to avoid animals in the street?
And everything is disputable brotha nothing is law. Even Einstein's theory of relativity is being disputed right now.
The idea of the spirit of deity of higher purpose has been around as long as we have. I just don't get how that shared belief can be found everywhere amongst all humans through out time but be totally false. Am I saying the bible or other holy books are factual? No. Do I believe there is far more going on than science can prove right now? Absolutely

 

You are killing me with these "then why do" questions. If a dog will save a hurt dog, why wouldn't a much smarter animal not do the same for the same reasons? Are you really being serious? A dolphin helping a drowning person is somehow indicative of the supernatural spirit? Really?

1. You don't want to damage your car.
2. Most people don't want to kill a living creature if they could avoid it i don't see what having a spirit has to do with that at all.

You wanna dispute evolution? With what? What do you replace it with? I'd love to see you give a better explanation of the diversity of life on this planet than evolution.

BTW the theory of relativity is being challenged by guess what? Another scientific idea. So in the small .0000000001 chance evolution is ever legitmaly challenged (creationism and intelligent design are laughable jokes) it will also be something that is natural in origin and can be peer reviewed and tested.

Well that seems like it's your problem then.

That's great news.

Yep and that was true 1000 years ago as well. And now everything we didn't know then that know now has a natural explanation to it. Not once has anything ever discovered that was not know previously had anything to do with the supernatural. Supernatural explanations have a beaming 100% failure rate. Same will be true 1000 years from now with things we can't explain currently. If you want to continue on with that tread of failure because you can't possibly be wrong because so many people believe in the supernatural go ahead.