A Black man Begging McCain

Dude. I don't care what you think about Ron Paul. You don't have to like him. If you wanna vote for Obama, that's fine. It does not matter to me. My support for Paul does not hinge on whether others support him. I like him because I agree with his policies. I'm not like some people here who like Obama because they hate Bush/McCain or like McCain because they hate Democrats. I vote for who I agree with and want to win, not for who is the most popular. Even if my candidate does not win, I can sleep at night because I voted my conscience.

So you're sadly mistaken, pal. I hate to burst your bubble but I'm not "frustrated" at all. But I wonder if Obama does not turn into the savior that you seem to think he is, will you be "frustrated"? :smt102 Only time will tell

 

That's just it, I don't consider Obama to be a "savior" and never did. It's people with no political leg to stand on who have sarcastically given him that title out of sour grapes. I do however consider him a master politician, who has so far outmanuevered and outclassed his opponents, and he certainly can't do any worse in the presidency than George W. Bush.

 

Yes he will.

 

Wassup rinnaye. Thanks for the warm welcome back.

I understand your concern about Obama's tax plan, but republicans raided the vault, and how the bill has come due. The current tax code is like swiss cheese and no one pays 35%. W made it that way for a reason.

Im just wondering tho...how can an increase in your tax rate of even 15% cause your costs to go up by 50%? And how will your taxes, which are figured at the bottom of your income statement effect your mortgage and operating expenses, which are well above tax expense on your income statement?

It doesnt compute that before tax expenses would increase by 50% from a tax increase of 10 or even 20 percent. Which, by the way is not what Obama is proposing. Obama wants to close all the loopholes that corporations are using not to pay their fair share of taxes. What he does plan to do is repeal W's tax rates, which lowered the rates from the Clinton era. And Im sure your will agree, the Clinton years were some of the most prosperous years in american history

Most people would consider CNN to be neutral. Here is what they have to say about Obama's plan...http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/10/09/fact-check-obama-tax-plan-and-small-businesses/

But nevertheless, your arguement about raising rent and having to evict your tenants is leaving out some majors keys to running a business in an economic fashion. Business costs increase all the time and when they do most businesses attack those costs by 1) eliminating waste and becoming more efficient 2) then passing on the remaining increase to customers as long as they can remain competitive, and 3) eating any remaining increases.

As long as you can remian competitive, then yeah, I guess you should pass on the increase to you tenants. But if your not as efficient as your competitors and you have to pass any increases on to them and your competition doesnt, you may have to find another business.

 

All good points Jelly.

The 50% figure I used is not intended to be actual, so I probably should have used a more realistic example for the purposes of this discussion.

 

Wow, I may be inviting a hoard of angry black men down on me! But I'll take my virtual chances on the fact that you are all such gentlemen, and love us white ladies, so maybe you'll be gentle.

I'll go ahead and voice my opinion. I honestly do love you guys, and would be more than thrilled to vote for a black man as president of this country. (I wish they had nominated Colin Powell.) Unfortunately, I cannot do so at this time, even though I like Obama, I think he is an excellent orator, a nice person, and has probably got good intentions. And the rest of the world would probably like the US better if we voted him in.

I mostly agree with Rinnaye, However, I am a white woman who doesn't make enough to be effected by the tax increases represented, not yet, anyway. I do own my own business, and plan to get there soon. I do believe in capitalism (with some regulations) and free enterprise. That is what has made America the richest country in the world for as long as we have been.

The fallout effect described by Rinnaye is actually my understanding of trickle down economics in reverse. (I may be wrong, Rinnaye sounds like he has a better understanding of it than I do.)

Why does everyone want to blame G. W. Bush for our current economic situation, when anyone who really thinks it through and understands business, will see that it takes a number of years for these types of economic turns to result after changes in policy. Remember the Democrats have controlled the House of Congress for some time, and the Policies implemented by Clinton have been at least in part to blame for the current melt down? Could it be that maybe Clinton reaped the benefits of Reagan economics?

Even if Bush is to blame, McCain is not Bush. Now, before you all get riled up, I am a conservative from Arizona, and I have not voted for McCain in many years. I don't personally like him. I disagree with a lot of his policies. But I will admit I do love Sarah Palin. (Sorry guys, maybe it's because she is a white woman who has taken on all odds and won. But then Hilary would have fit that bill also, and I respected Hilary but didn't like her very much.) I like to think it's because Sarah believes like I do, in marriage, life, the American dream, small government, free enterprise, oh, and Yes! God!

What can I say! That's me! I don't care about her experience, nor do I site Obama for his lack thereof.

Even McCain has no experience being a president of this country. Anyway women tend to be quick studies! Should she ever need it, I'm sure she'll find a way to learn real quick or get the proper advice. (We're real good at that.)

If I had been voting in the 60's I would have voted democratic for Kennedy. If I had lived in the late 19th century I would have voted republican for Lincoln. I believe in civil rights, but not in welfare.

Now just be nice to me guys, you know I'm new here.:yawinkle:

 

1) Clinton is partially responsible. He didnt veto the gramm-leach-bliley act which started the deregulation ball rolling. (Yes, gramm as in phil gramm.)

And clinton didnt reap the benefits of reagan. Actually reagan did the same thing as w with tax breaks for the wealthy and out of control government spending which led to a recession and caused the first bush not to be re-elected.

2) It is w's fault because he kicked the deregulation ball down the hill with no brakes and compounded its negative effect on our economy by giving such huge tax breaks to the wealthy and corporations. (This should prove to americans that trickle-down economics doesnt work.)

3) Democrats have only controlled congress for the last two years. Republicans controlled it for w's first six.

4) Mccain isnt w, but he does want to continue reagan and w's ideas of trickle-down economics. (Do you really want another four years of this crap?)

5) Sarah Palin??? And to compare her to Obama is insulting. She couldnt get into harvard if she was the janitor and had two sets of keys. (The janitor might actually be smarter than her.)

You dont make any sense. You dont personally like mccain and you dont like his policies. You like sarah palin and think she's a quick study and might make good decisions despite the fact that this is the same woman who fired qualified people in alaska to hire her friends, "stole" money (she charged to state when she stayed in her home), abused her power, and had her husband sit in on government meetings and conduct state business. So exactly why are you voting republican? Maybe...you just dont like the idea of a black president?...

And america isnt rich because of capitalism and free enterprise. Its rich because it stole its land from native americans and built up its wealth on the enslavement of blacks!

 

I could bash on Democrats for a long time, if I thought that would help, I know it won't. As to Sarah getting into Harvard, maybe she just isn't as rich as Obama. As to your other allegations, you're just repeating what you've heard, and are not putting any real research into the practices of the candidates. And she does compare to Obama, she has invaded a realm that has been dominated by white men for many, many years, and she beat Hilary at that game. As to experience, I sited McCain also saying he to will have to learn a few things as he goes, because none of these candidates has any experience as President.

When I said I don't like McCain, I meant personally, I would not enjoy sitting down to eat a meal with he and his wife. I think they would boar me. As to his policies, mostly I think he's too liberal. I am very frustrated with his economic package, because I feel it's too far out there. I do agree with him on some things, mostly I think he's the better of two evils. Sarah on the other hand will bring a fresh mind to the white house. Someone who is not so wound up in politics as usual. Now her I can support!

As to me not wanting a black president. You are very mistaken, I think America is very ready for one, it shows in the poles, because is not an issue. You see the poles show that the country is just as divided as it was last election, 50/50 or real close. If it were about race we would be seeing something very different, and in very different areas. I wish there was a black man running that I could vote for.

About the video that started this thread, I give the man a lot of respect for being willing to stand up for what he believes in, in spite of knowing it will alienate a lot of his friends and family. I do wish he hadn't used the words, "I beg you" though, that does seem like he is brown nosing just a bit. I don't like to see anyone in that light.

I know quite a number of black men/women, who will be voting for McCain/Palin in this election. Military men, pastors of churches, business owners, and laymen, here in AZ where I live it is definitely not about race. I'm sorry you can't see these black people as voting for what they believe in, instead of accusing them of somehow turning their back on other black people. That my dear sir sounds very racist on your part. At least to me it does.

I stand by capitalism, try owning a business of your own, you may just prefer that to being someone else's employee. (I don't care how much you make.) It's a lot of work, you won't make it rich overnight, but you have a lot better chance there than you do to win the lottery. (Plan on paying a lot of taxes! Especially if your guy wins!)

 

First of all Obama wasnt rich when he got into harvard, and as for palin, i dont think she can spell "harvard." I guess your right in a sense, I am repeating what I have heard, but considering mccain's people have told her to "shut up and stick to the script" (she only gives interviews to fox news...mccain too, for that matter) the only thing people have to go on is what's reported. Yeah, I know..."she's a maverick, and a reformer, and she's got more executive experience than Obama!" Please. And the last dim-witted governor that became president turned out real well.

And palin doesnt even come close to clinton, either. As Ive said before, a true litmus test of a candidate is their ability to stand toe-to-toe with their their toughest critics and answer their questions. Or at least go on one of the "neutral" shows such as meet the press on do CNN. Clinton went on o'reilly (Obama, too) and has done countless other interviews. The two times palin has done non-fox interviews they were train wrecks! (Im not gonna go down the "intelligence" road on clinton vs. palin because
that battle would be just as ugly for palin.)

As for mccain, his economic package should be the least of anyone's concerns. And I dont understand how anyone other than white men could vote for him. He voted against equal pay for women and has consisently voted against all civil rights legislation. Even if I was an independent I wouldnt vote for him because of his sleazy campain he's ran.

And perhaps you need to do some research and not assume. Ive researched the candidates quite well. I didnt say blacks who dont vote for Obama are turning therir backs on black people. And how do you know that I dont own a business? And it is about race because if Obama was white this race wouldnt even be close. And it doesnt sound like you've done youre homework if you think youre gonna pay "alot of taxes" if Obama wins. If your business is netting you well over $250k then I dont think you qualify as a small business.

And I didnt say that american wasnt ready for a black president, I said you werent ready for a black president. Maybe you are...maybe you're not. Who knows?

 

The Jellybird/Tinkerbell debate is looking a lot like the Biden/Palin one. If you recall, Biden won that one.

 

Nobody Wins!

There will always be 3 things people shall never agree on, and it's race, religion, and politics. This thread obviously falls within one of those 3 categories. I think the Tinkerbell/Jelly debate has valid points on either side of the aisle, and no matter who wins, we're all still screwed. I personally do not have a dog in this fight. McCain wants a longer occupation in Iraq, which is absurd, and I'll never go along with that, and Obama at least hangs out just a wee bit too far to the left for me. I mean, he's even farther left than Clinton, on certain issues, I believe he want's to give drivers licences to illegals, *EEEK*! But that's another red herring in this discussion.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/02/obama-defends-d.html

So, at the very least, we're screwed either way. Should Obama win The White House, then, us Blacks may lose a significant crutch of an argument, no longer being able to continue to accuse America of being so "racist", and Whites can finally get the guilt of white priviledge off of their shoulders, as they'll say, "At least we voted a Black into office, Now fcuk-off!"

 

Not to diss your post, but I'm a bit more optimistic about the future than you are. No matter what happens in this election, the glass will always be half-full for me because that's the kind of person that I am and that's the kind of person I will always be. I refuse to think that we're screwed either way because that signals a pessimistic mentality.

Things have to get bad before they become better, it's called progress and it has always remained true as history has shown us. Slavery was long and very difficult, but it indeed was over in it's own time. Remember there was once a time where you had to literally ask god to forgive you for even thinking about lusting after a white woman.

Are those days still here?

 

Nah black, I don't see that as a diss.

You're entitled to that observation, and for the most part, I agree with your half full scenario, except on the issue of the economy, and especially when I only hear all of the economic pundits say, as bad as things are now, they still have yet to get worse. No one wants to even say we are "officially" in a recession yet, with the definition of that being "two consecutive quarters of negative economic growth". So with that said, I highly doubt Obama will be able to stop the current economic trend.

Respectfully.

 

So the question now my dear Jellybird, is, how do we (you and I) remain/become friends which such differing views?

I'm glad we can have these discussions on line, because I would be quite shy to approach such subjects with people in person, since they are so very personal and sensitive. But indeed this is what makes America so great!

Should you meet someone like me in public, our maybe as a friend of a friend:

1.Do we discuss politics or religion?
2.Are these subjects taboo?
3.Do we agree to disagree? (This is the one I chose.)
4.Do we feel it our moral obligation to convince the other?
5.Do we completely think the other is a fool for not thinking like we do?
6.Or what would you suggest?

Anyone else care to answer that, or should it be the subject of another thread? Remember I'm still new here, not quite sure about the proper etiquette for these things.

 

Gen. Colin Powell just endorsed Obama yay!

 

Yup, great news.

 

Great, another peacemaker. A brotha comes looking for a fight...and all I get is a hug.

You're not related to bookworm, are you?

As Ive said before, my online personality is completely different than how I am in person. I dont talk much politics in real life.

If I met you in person...what we would talk about would depend on how sexy you are. If you are smoking hot, we would talk about why you are single...me getting your phone number...and where we are going on our first date. If you are "ok looking"...we discuss religion. And if you're hideous...we discuss race and politics.

 

After reading all 10 pages...and because I'm apparently procrastinating on Sunday chores:


1. Increase your operating expenses while maintaining the same level of gross profit decreases your net profit and therefore your taxable income. So, I'm not quite sure how an tax increase on businesses is going to increase your operating expenses, and even if it does, it would actually benefit you come income tax time if your operating expenses indeed did increase at such a rate.

2. Some of these McCain/Palin supporters SCARE ME. I'll save the stories about how I live in a really racist town and how i took my kids out of a restaurant Friday night because of the conversation going on at the next table over for another day.

3. BOO SARAH PALIN. Politics aside, I find it interesting that the same reporters who referred to Jamie Lynn Spears as the worst mother ever when it came out that the younger Spears sister was pregnant (and was announced that she was keeping the baby and marrying the father) are treating Sarah Palin like she's mother of the year for her influence on Bristol's decision to keep the baby and marry the father.

I make no sense, I know this. I just really don't want to pick up the house and make lunches and feed dogs right now.

 

So, you may actually be a gentleman after all! How sweet! Unless of course we meet and you immediately begin a discussion of race and politics.

No relation to bookworm that I am aware of! Sorry, you won't get a real fight from me, just some thought provoking posts, I hope. I really am just interested in how ya'll think. I guess that's the honesty in me. I'm not looking for an argument. I'm really am nice lady. (At least that's what I think.) :wink:

As to how and what we would talk about, What if I'm a curvy petite, on the thick side, with a pretty face, but of another generation, (unless you're older than you sound/ and God knows black men look younger than they are so why wouldn't they sound younger too?) and single but spoken for?

Do you think we would talk about religion then? (We probably wouldn't agree there either.) Or, Maybe I could introduce you to a younger friend/relative, that is if you're actually nice in the real world.