Ishvara:
Of course you are a woman of conviction! But, even when women say they work because they want to...it is really because they have to work. It isn't a choice when it is mandated is it? I do not put down working women. I do think that they should raise their family first before going 'out there' or work at home to be near your children. I am appauled at seeing daycare kids on a playground lined up behind the bars of a local daycare center here looking for and waiting for their mothers to come get them as they watch every car that drives by. And this goes on everyday. They look like little prisoners. They would be better off if members of their own family were taking care of them.
Also, there is more power in a child being able to have their fathers family name than we can now imagine. Only time can show us what that means for the future direction our children will take. Hopefully, they won't be scattered like just blown away leaves.
What I say has nothing to do with any one person on this board. But it has alot to do with all of us and what kind of world we want to leave to our children. Take care.

By Ishvara (38.163.112.115) on Wednesday, June 6, 2001 - 09:58 am:

"Quit sending your women out to work when it costs more for her to work outside than stay home and take care of your family." Nobody sends me to work I go because I want to. These sorts of decisions are worked out between partners. Who will stay home who will go to work. Fulfillment, accomplishments, different activities bring these feelings out in different people. What fulfills me might not neccessarily fulfill you.

As far as Roberto comment, "Unlike some white women here on this board, you speak with conviction." I think all the women here speak with conviction. I myself have very strong convictions based on how I live my life and treat people, I don't try to say my way is the right way or the only way just one of the ways. I find many here to be biased in their viewpoints. Maybe it's the generation gap, the old ways are the better ways, who says and what proof.

Marriage piece of paper has nothing to do with commitment. My sister having been with her man for ten years with two children before they decide to marry and my niece and nephew are two of the most very well behaved, respectful, bright children I have met in a long while. My mate and I have intentions to marry eachother, I will not be hurried by impending birth. As Wyatt said before it has a lot to do with the commitment to eachother the externals be damned.

By Kansascity (209.242.125.195) on Wednesday, June 6, 2001 - 06:29 am:

An out-of-wedlock child will always feel betrayed somehow and cheated. It is not only a "sin" to put that kind of PAIN on a child after conceiving and giving him birth (without thinking first), it is not wise nor smart. Why don't people understand this simple truth? It is so obvious it GLARES at us...look around you. How many happy people do you see these days? I do not believe in AB's...
And on the other hand: The old saying goes: If you were WOMAN ENOUGH to lay down and get pregant then you should be woman enough to bring that child forth and raise him.
Or, a woman could have her baby adopted to a family and worry for the rest of her life if her child was adopted by good people or bad. How would she ever know?
So then many women decide to keep their babies and try to make the best of it. Like Helen Ready use to sing "You and Me against the world...etc." Only the reality is not quite so easy.
It is damn hard raising children alone, struggling to bring them up right only to have them fall in with children who are not brought up with wholesome values or are corrupted already. This usually takes place in our school systems all across this country. The schools are not good for kids trying to become educated and many cannot in present school environments. The schools and social workers always want to blame the parents or parent...yet the schools are the ones who are perpetuating the PROBLEM. I have seen and heard it all with the schools.
No wonder so many teachers are leaving..the profession. Instead of teaching real subjects they are expected to indoctrinate our kids into things like accepting alternative lifestyles all in the BS name of DIVERSITY and GLOBALISM. It is a HOAX.
I really think that moms who stay at home while fathers go out and work, have an excellent opportunity to hook up with the homeschool movement and start a revolution in education. To hell with school boards. Who the hell are these people anyway. They are so secretive and strange acting.
And men who are lucky enough to have a woman at home holding down the fort must appreciate all the work that is involved in keeping up a home! It is WORK. Quit sending your women out to work when it costs more for her to work outside than stay home and take care of your family.
Protecting your families is what it is all about. Forget the bad schools out there and keep your children home and school them yourself. It really would change things for the better if more parents could do it. Don't worry what other people think ...just do it.

By Kansascity (209.242.125.195) on Wednesday, June 6, 2001 - 06:02 am:

Wyatt: Young People fear Marriage for good reasons! Our government does not support marriage for low income folks! Is it only for those who have more money?
Why is it most every social program seems more geared toward giving the double-edged sword helping hand to single women with children while the fathers are off in the margins somewhere...as if they do not even exist!?
What if a young married couple gets into serious financial, health or other troubles and the only help available is so minimal compared to the single parents who have a number of 'programs' at their disposal?
If a young married couple with or without children needs support getting started why is it so HARD for our society to understand that? Does everybody need to have a college degree and money in the bank to marry? What happened to just getting married because it is A GOOD THING?
There are so very many roadblocks to marriage and that is why so many are going around the whole issue. We are caught up in this snare and trap. Even couples who were married when they had children and tried to do everything right are falling by the wayside right along with the "To Hell with conventions...lets have a baby crowd!"
In our society today, married couples and their children are an anomoly. They are ridiculed and scorned....even in our corrupted educational system. Why is that? And what kind of a message does that send to our children? Not a good one...that is for sure. No wonder young people just want to go around the whole 'marriage thing' and try to have a LIFE without it. They are afraid.

By Anon2000 (208.187.244.63) on Wednesday, June 6, 2001 - 01:29 am:

kc,
do you believe that it is a "sin" to have an OOW child?

By Wyatt (207.106.60.186) on Tuesday, June 5, 2001 - 09:48 am:

KC,

This counterculture seems to be a bit misguided don't you think? It cost a heck of a lot more to have baby than to pay for a $25 marriage license and got the Justice of the peace. I think it is more about a fear of failure, fear of the committment and fear of working at anything. This generation(not all)have watched institutions and parents let them down, they have watched divorce on a mass scale and it has doomed them to this hypercautiousness. The problem with this, and since I work to house the poor in my city and advocate for them in the court, is that i see too many women coming in because they have babies that they can't properly take care themselves, since the guy they had the child with is not in the picture. This is a massive problem in the poor communities throughout America, but now has spread to the larger world. In Newsweek two weeks ago, an article about single parenting and the travials of families where they think it is easy to do this. Well it isn't for black and hispanic women who will be subject to low paying jobs and poverty if they have children out of wedlock and no real committment to the father of the child. I am well aware of the counterculture scene. I live dead center of the counterculture-and the anxiety, the ambiquity, apathy is loud and clear. It saddens me that people think that emotions and feelings are that easily tossed aside just for sexual gradification. Where are the people who are compassionate, but use common sense? We need a renewal of common sense, ya'll!! I don't mean a turning back of the clock to 1950's(those were not such great times either), but a renewed sense of committment to the people that we say we are in love with, a committment to the children we bring into this world, a respect for marriage vows and the sacred marriage bed. Without it we are living virtually in an anarchistic world where anything goes and know one can stir it right again.

Cma:
Certainly, I think people get married too easily in America and they get divorced too easily as well. Sure, there are concrete reasons for getting a divorce(domestic violence-get out now!!!; infidelity; danger to children). But incompatibility, grew apart, didn't like each other anymore? These are not good reasons to get divorced. Back to marriage. People in America get married based on some pretty superficial stuff. They get married because they say they love each other, but can't tell you what love is. They get married because they have the same racial background, or same economic background, or becuase the guy or gal is sexy. These are pathetic reasons. Or he make he feel good about myself. So does a doctor. What is missing is what values we hold dear; what committments we have to God, our community or families. A few questions should be asked first; how do you plan to handle arguments, loss of job, can you control your emotions, are you violent, why do we have to sleep together before marriage. And many other questions that are supposed to be asked during the courting phase. But I know more people who meet people at bars, sleep with them that night, move in together in 3 weeks, get married and divorced in 18 months. They never talked about each others likes and dislikes, they never became friends first. Sex was the mitigating factor for their marriage. And this along with emotional immaturity is the damning issue.
Prenups are a sign of selfishness, greed, instability, insecurity, a lust for material possession and not for true love. A person is pretty pathetic to ask for a pre nupt. I tell my wife, take it all, it is yours just leave me the dog!

By Kansascity (209.242.125.211) on Tuesday, June 5, 2001 - 12:12 am:

Wyatt: I could not have said it better! But, their is a counter-culture that is not wanting to marry before the babies come you know? And, it is very hard to convince these young couples that it is a sin to live together before marriage...but they think that they cannot afford to marry yet? There is truth in that belief. Anyway, nature will always take its course...and their are those who will exploit this situation. As the old saying goes: "When will they ever learn?"

By Cma (216.249.73.110) on Monday, June 4, 2001 - 04:04 pm:

Wyatt, you are a very wise person. I learn something everytime I read your posts, bro. I think what you said here makes a lot of sense. Me and a friend were talking about this last night at dinner. A co-worker in his 50s told him not to ever get married, that it's a mistake. And that you can be happier living like a playboy instead of settling down. Although I think it might be fun to live like a playboy in your 20s, that is not something I'd want for myself in the long run. I'm not one of those guys that envies someone like Hugh Hefner. I think it's rather pathetic to live such a shallow, materialistic, lust-filled life. Sure, I like looking at beautiful, busty women as much as the next guy, but I'd rather be happily married and devoted to a woman I love than have a different playboy bunny every night. (thought I wouldn't mind a PB bunny right now while I'm single).

Wyatt, do you think that maybe people get married to easily? It seems like religious people I know, such as Mormons, that get married don't take a long time to get married. And they seem to have strong values behind their decisions. It's like their church community demands it. I take it their divorce rates and rates of single motherhood are low too. It seems to me that people that are not devotedly religious that get married too soon end up in divorce. My parents are in their early 50s and still together, so divorce is not something I've ever known, and I hope it never is.

Hey and one more thing, I was talking with this friend of mine a few days ago, she said that if she marries a man, she's going to demand a prenuptual agreement. I was thinking that this is such a selfish thing to do. And my opinion of this friend is that she does tend to the self-centered and selfish side. What do you guys think about prenups? If any woman requested this, I don't think I could marry her. It's like you are starting your relationship mired in distrust.

By Ishvara (38.163.112.57) on Monday, June 4, 2001 - 01:20 pm:

Wyatt, just want you to know that was beautifully insightful and I think the same kinds of things.

By Wyatt (207.106.60.23) on Monday, June 4, 2001 - 10:48 am:

KC,

Why are marriages falling apart and divorces so popular? My take on it is a cultural shift which has contributed to the overall destruction of the family and love in this society.

We are so wrapped up in the pursuit of the material and not in the interest of building community, character, personality and duty. People are trying to have the prize with out the work that goes along with it. 60% shack up and have sex premarriage, when they have been told for 25 years that those who shack up first have the highest rate of divorce. People go into marriage and relationships with all feelings(it has to be wine and roses and fireworks) and then when that ends they are out of here! Expectations are not too high, they are way out of wack and/or non-existent.
I love my wife, I court her still and I prize her highly-but that does not mean that we are not going to disagree, get angry and fight. This is part of the relationship. She and I have to be honest with each other and not accept everything coming around. There is nothing wrong with rules and sets of values that must be shared first. it has nothing to do with sexual compatibility. Everyone talks about that, but they rarely talk about moral and ethical values and compatibility. These are what makes for a long lasting relationships not sex or material things. Sexual compatibility is a process that starts with mutual respect and takes a long time to build and should be apart of the whole relationship, but it is not the glue. Respect and honest and self-denial and giving is the glue.
Why is divorce the most prevalent in the South and not in the Northeast(New England has the lowest rates). Because they think that marriage is the answer to everything in their FEELINGS. Feelings don't last and racial and sexual compatibility is a myth. Love is all about the heart and the head. Think before you leap and know what is right before letting your feelingss and passions move you.

By Kansascity (209.242.125.19) on Monday, June 4, 2001 - 01:04 am:

It is not really about race anymore, is it? Could it be more about CLASS...having it? There are differences in the way men and women relate according to how they were raised.
Our ideas about how a male and female relate have more to do with CLASS...don't you think?
There are also different relationship styles...some are much more successfull than others.
Accountability, loyalty, truthfullness, morals, good values and good old common sense can make a relationship stand the test of time.
The mating game can be dangerous, but the rewards can be great and so good,too. What is the younger generation learning about what is involved in a relatinship? Who are their examples? Is anybody bothering to teach them all about it...and not just the teachers in 'Health and Reproduction' courses in high school/college.
Family Law...is exploiting the ignorance of people who are not adept at forming lasting relationships. Lawyers can feed off their pain....with the break-up of families. Children are often not able to adapt as was previously assumed.
After the wine, roses, and loving...why are so many couples falling apart? Why so many divorces? Why does abuse or bordom set in?
Maybe expectations vary between a couple...that are not the same.
Our parents are our first role models. And, if they made mistakes, are we doomed to do the same?

By Frangiapani (203.54.206.88) on Friday, June 1, 2001 - 11:58 pm:

Cma,...Swampfox,

Thanks for your kind words, that is when I was crazy and decided to post my pic up on here for a week, I dont think Ill be doing that again though..

Cma, how have you been?

By Cma (216.249.83.242) on Friday, June 1, 2001 - 09:00 pm:

Swampfox, I'm in agreement. I would take the nice butt over big breasts anyday. Although both would be nice. I'm not what you'd call a "titi man" although I can sure appreciate a nice set of hooters when they're there.

I've also seen Frangiapani's pix and she is a lovely girl. Here's what it comes down to with women, brains, beauty and personality. You usually get 2 out of the three and sometimes not that. Fran seems to be one of those rare girls that has all three. Yeah, she'll make some guy a nice girlfriend or wife one day. I hope someday I'll get lucky and run across someone like her. But there ain't too many of 'em I'm sad to say.

I agree with something else you've said before too. And that is, why is it that black women won't give a brotha the time of day unless they see him talking to a white girl? I can't figure that sh*t out, man. I'm not the stereotypical black guy wearing FUBU, trying to act like Jay-Z and Cisco. But it seems that if you want a BW, you've got to be like those guys. And it seems like the better looking the black girl is, the more she's into those types. And those white girls that try to be black girls are the worse of all. I literally cannot stand them.

By Swampfox8 (63.31.210.93) on Friday, June 1, 2001 - 08:26 pm:

Hey everyone, i have not been visiting this site lately and just checked it today and liked the subject. I like all women but i really have better luck with white women for some reason. I just connect and get along with them better and like Modulis i don't like the dreads,cornrows or the trying to sound like some black women do. I'm just really attracted to them!!! I've seen Frangiapani's photo and if i saw her on the street or at the mall i would without hesitating go over and talk to her- she's gorgeous!!!!! As far as the butt thing, i just like the way it accents a woman's figure! It doesn't have to be really big though. I'd take a woman with small breasts and a nice but over what society thinks is ideal!!

By Sabbadoo32 (12.2.19.162) on Thursday, May 31, 2001 - 12:14 pm:

I for one get a little nervous whenever I ask a woman out. I got shut down last Saturday night by an Asian woman. I think I may have another shot at it, since we were both at a large pub crawl where she was the only sober one and I was 3 sheets to the wind. I don't think my delivery was at its very best.

ANYWAY, I used to worry about it. No more. I'm not so cavalier as to ask out everyone in a 50-foot radius. But I don't hesitate to strike up a conversation, if circumstances dictate. I also pay attention to my gut. Sometimes you just know when a person is interested in you. Usually I'm 75% right. Whether that interest leads to love, who knows. But you can't go anywhere without interest.

Sheri, I totally agree with you. I have a lot of friends, and can get into a rut of going places where I feel there is less chance of meeting a woman interested in black men. I'm not saying they're not at the same event, but they may not make a move or show a sign because they may feel uncomfortable about doing it in front of their girlfriends or other members of the circle. So I try to go to events where people are probably a bit more cosmopolitan and tolerant.

But as far as the size of a woman's backside, "junk in the trunk" can become a "calamity in the cellar" when the metabolism slows. I've dated women with "junk in the trunk," I honestly think I'll end up settling down with someone thin and trim. Not model skinny, but
height/weight proportional.

By Hectorvelasquez (204.248.131.200) on Tuesday, May 29, 2001 - 04:57 am:

I imagine that some black men are cautious when wanting to talk to or ask a white female out. Some don't know what the word caution means when it comes to women. I have seen black men just out of the blue say hello or ask for the name of white women or any women period, while they were walking down the street on a Saturday night. Some women respond to this, others don't. It depends on the man, some men are cautious, others, the professional "players" I suppose are not.

I am not so bold. I usually try to make eye contact and see how the person responds and proceed from there. Some women I have noticed will wait of some sign of a common interest and then attempt to strike up a conversation with me. I'll also "advertise" so to speak what I am about by the type of conversation I may be having with someone. If I'm in a "class" bar I might talk about French or Italian politics with the bartender, and sometimes there will be some women following the conversation who will comment and things proceed from there. I think many people are looking for some type of common interest to sustain a conversation.

If I were in a black club and saw a white woman giving me a slight warm smile, that would probably be a dead giveaway of some sort of interest.

I however have no real idea what goes through the minds of black men, who are into white women as a fetish, other than when and how they are going to get………….

By Frangiapani (203.54.206.250) on Tuesday, May 29, 2001 - 03:19 am:

So black men are cautious when wanting to ask a WW out? I never know what to make of it, once this guy was giving me strange looks, I thought it was because I was white and he thought I was after him or something (I was in a club at the time in a mostly black environment) Turns out, he wanted to talk to me and we became good friends after that. Maybe Im just being over paranoid or not reading the signs right, but Id love to know what goes through these guys minds when ive been given a "look"...you know what I mean?

By Hectorvelasquez (204.248.133.169) on Monday, May 28, 2001 - 11:10 pm:

"I think you would be truly surprised at how many white women are not only curious but attracted to you gorgeous men!"

I agree with this statement, only you have to be in the right environment. Some environments are much better than others.

By Sheri (66.12.20.194) on Wednesday, May 23, 2001 - 04:26 pm:

Some advise for the guys:

First of all, I have to agree that no one - white girl, black man - whatever, specifically say who dates who just by looking at them. We all have pretty good guesses, I'm sure. Some advise to you guys out there searching; I think you would be missing out by not approaching a female, no matter what her race, due to the fact that you "doubt" she dates anyone but white men.

I think you would be truly surprised at how many white women are not only curious but attracted to you gorgeous men! I wonder, looking back, if the brave men had not approached me, would I be dating black men today? Probably not. I was raised in an all white community. Dating outside of the caucasion race was not looked upon with approval - at all! When I went away to college, I was in entirely different world! Eventhough I was so, so attracted to the black male students, I had no idea how to approach them, what to say to them, curious what they thought of me, scared to death as to what my father would do if he found out. So, I stayed away from the entire situation. That could have been the best time of my life.

So, I grew up a bit, lived and learned, still deal with my father on the issue and am quite happy that I am open and expressive about my choice in men. Thankfully, some of you guys out there were brave enough to approach the shy, white girl from a small farm community. So go for it guys - you might truly be surprised!

By Poetic1 (216.164.199.129) on Wednesday, May 23, 2001 - 01:40 pm:

I have quietly read the posts on this site but, I have never responded until now.

Like everyone else what I have to say is, purely, opinion and speculation. That said, let me add my two cents...

On the question of the physical tastes of Black men...

On the "Booty" question and why Black men seem to be attracted to the "non-traditional" "non-Madison Avenue White mainstream" image of the "ideal" woman. Let's take a somewhat freudian view of the situation. Think about this...what is the predominant, female, model for men of african heritage? Like any other culture/race, I would conjecture that it is their mothers. No, I am not going down the road toward saying that Black men have an Oedipus complex. What i am saying is that subconsciosly the ideal woman is, physically, our mothers. Even men of Caucasian persuasion, if the truth be told, are more apt to select the physique that is closest to their mother's than they are to select Kate Moss or All McBeal for that matter. Some, or all, of you may disagree with this but, if you are objective about it you may find some truth in it - although, I will agree that this is an idea that is subjective in its nature. ...For me, it is a woman who is proportionate height to weight, how she carries herself and her being...if she has it and doesn't have the need to flaunt it...oozes confidence and thereby, has a surety of self...and wild hair to boot...HEY!!! I'm hooked...LOL

On the question of knowing whether or not a WF is attracted to a BM...

HMMMMMMMMMMMM...I haven't a clue. I was married for twenty years to a French-Canadian woman. She was not my first but, I was, and still am, the only Black male that she was ever involved with. We are now divorced. When I met her, I wasn't thinking about whether she was attracted to Black men or interested in interracial dating...I just knew that I liked what I saw and heard and wanted to get to know her. Now, since being divorced three years and living in Philly...I can't tell. I will say this though...every once in awhile I will come across an ad (on the personals sites) and I will see a face and find myself saying either, "she doesn't date Black guys" or "she dates Black guys" and I have been right...not 100% but at least 3 out of 4 times. Now, does that mean that I am in tune with some kind of radar...naaaaahhhhh...I was just lucky in my guess. In the real world it is another thing. Like some hear have said, it is a crap shoot that in most cases is a crap shoot. You throw your dice and you take your chance. I am not one who goes to bars or clubs, I hate the superficiality of the whole thing - so I have to find other outlets. I am not shy so I will be inclined to flirt sometimes in a theater or at the Art museum or in a department store. for the most part though...I am a nice guy so I don't get aggressive about it and, for want of not risking the lady's offense, I remain passively attentive until I "see some kind of sign." Does it work..."HELL no!!! Why do you think I run ads and attend internet discussion boards...LOL

Now...somebody wann give me a clue as to how I can fine tune my radar...my head is killing me from trying to figure it out.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it...

Peace
Brad

By Anon2000 (207.218.73.213) on Tuesday, May 22, 2001 - 12:49 am:

hector,
the frat boys "live to party", one reason they are knowledgeable about rotr!! it's really more than a reggae show, it's a PARTY! you DO know where rotr is held, don't you? case closed!

i have no idea of the actual breakdown, but there are LOTS of women. it's probably 50/40 men/women. aren't men more rabid music fans than women? i've always noticed this...

By Hectorvelasquez (63.175.45.62) on Sunday, May 20, 2001 - 11:33 pm:

What do Alumni associations get together to do? It kinda depends on what you want to use the thing for, but basically network. They might have something like young happy hour night or black networking night or they might plan trips to other countries.....For example, my Alumni association is planning a trip to Egypt next year.

To be honest, my Alumni organization is one of the reasons I went to the college I went to.

It's just a suggestion, you might hate the people that go to these types of functions.

No I'm not black Hispanic, I don't even speak Spanish, I just pulled the name Hectorvelasquez out of my head.


Anon, 50% white 25% black. I forgot to ask you what is the gender breakdown, what percentage is male and what percentage is female? You mentioned frat-boys, frat-boys are the last people I would expect to see at a Reggae concert.

By Anon2000 (207.218.73.128) on Sunday, May 20, 2001 - 08:19 pm:

hector,
well, lets see...i've been attending reggae shows for at least 15 years. it is about 50% white, 25% black, and the rest all else. when i first started attending, there were about 75% white there, so it seems to be opening up more black people's interest. i think that's great!

reggae on the river has a limit of 10000 people, so it's like a miniature city! that was my very first reggae show of any kind and it basically blew me away. many people think it's a frat boy scene, although i don't. it's a GREAT party, one you'll never forget, that's for sure.

i grew up in southern cali and moved to northern cali when i was 28 and there (WAS anyway) a big difference in philosophies between the parts of the state. i don't think it's as conservative as it used to be anymore, but cma can clue you in there. i rarely even visit anymore. although i miss the great weather in socal, the interracial climate (to me) is much preferable and a lot more liberal.

get out there and enjoy some reggae shows, y'all! it's the best reggae summer i've seen in a looooong time.

By Cma (216.249.73.84) on Sunday, May 20, 2001 - 04:45 pm:

Hector,

Don't worry about going into Bruin territory, this isn't frat boy time. The dreadheads and hippies could care less what school you go to. Most the people at the fest don't even go to UCLA.

I've heard of Alumni associations, but don't really know what they're all about. I'll check into mine. What do they get together to do? I don't know much about them.

And as to your questions about the breakdown of reggae shows, it's truly the united nations, there is literally everything, there is no racial majority. Although in N. California, most are probably white due to the demographics of the area.

One more thing, given that your name is Spanish, are you a black Hispanic that likes WW?

By Hectorvelasquez (65.160.185.212) on Sunday, May 20, 2001 - 03:37 pm:

Cma, since you are graduating and you don't like bar/clubs you might try getting involved with your college Alumni association. Some Alumni associations, depending on what college or uni you went to have agreements with other Alumni associations so, if you were not really impressed with the selection of people at your college, you would not have be around these same people.

One of the reasons why they have these things is so that people of the same socioeconomic position marry people from the same or similar position.

If you do graphic design you might try some professional organization. I have also found that women in "artistic" circles tend to be more open. This includes some aspiring actresses or mattresses and theatre people as well (a mattress is a model/waitress /actress). There are A WHOLE LOT of aspiring actresses and mattresses in LA. If you haven't, try going to some of the smaller theatres (there are a whole lot of these too), and check the theatre "scene" out.

By Hectorvelasquez (65.160.186.37) on Sunday, May 20, 2001 - 02:29 pm:

Anon also, what would you say is the ethnic breakdown at big Reggae Festevals? I think or I suspect......I'm not sure, there is a tendancy in the young black community to not support "musical styles" that are don't fall into Rap/R&B catagory-- people like Macy Gray or Lenny Kravits. I met a woman a while ago who was livid about the black community not supporting her, because she didn't sing like Destiny's Child and didn't talk about getting her bills paid.

By Hectorvelasquez (65.160.186.37) on Sunday, May 20, 2001 - 02:00 pm:

Well CMA I don't usually go into Bruin territory (trying to find cheap parking in Westwood is on par with trying to see atoms), I'm partial to the "University of South Central" right now, but I guess I can make an exception.

Anon, thanks. I you don't mind can you please tell my ignorant self about how many people would be at a Reggae On The River fest? How big is it?

Would you also agree that Northern California is more liberal than Southern California?

By Anon2000 (207.218.73.144) on Sunday, May 20, 2001 - 11:25 am:

well, hector, as a matter of fact, i do. i will be volunteering at two of them: the two biggest are the sierra nevada world music festival in june (snwmf.com) and reggae on the river (reggaeontheriver.com) in august. however, the last one is sold out. the snwmf has a TERRIFIC lineup, many oldtimers (well, that's relative, but...!) you just don't see at all anymore. they are outdoors with camping. all in all, this year is looking to be mindblowing for reggae festivals in cali!

for a complete listing of all the reggae festivals in the u.s. and some outside, go to:

www.reggaefestivalguide.com

have fun!

By Cma (216.249.84.12) on Saturday, May 19, 2001 - 01:25 pm:

Hector, the UCLA jazz/reggae fest will be on memorial day weekend.

By Hectorvelasquez (204.248.136.213) on Saturday, May 19, 2001 - 06:18 am:

Anon, I'm not posting here as much as I used to, but do you know of any specific Regge fests going on in Southern California soon?

By Anon2000 (207.218.73.210) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 11:48 pm:

modulis,
you live in california, home of a HUGE reggae fan population! man, get out there this summer and go to those reggae festivals! you will find very cool young ladies there of all races. believe me, it's very easy for a brother to meet a girl there. music festivals of all kinds are wonderful ways to meet single women!

By Cma (216.249.87.130) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 11:18 pm:

Sheri,

I am 24, will turn 25 on the 26th (look at the number sequence, that'll only happen once!). I am surprised I have never dated interracially either. And trust me, I'd more than like too. As to what you said about imagine the way it was 30 years ago, imagine how it was 200 years ago! Believe it or not, there were a few interracial couples even during slavery. Frederick Douglass the abolitionist was married to a white woman. I can't imagine what that would've been like in the mid-19th century.

Ishvara,

Why there is a difference between body preferences between WM and BM? It's just culture. At one time, thick "rubenesque," but shapely WW were considered sublime( I still think they are!), but now the white male is caught up on this Barbie thing. Long blonde hair, blue eyes, flat ass and ribs showing. Why they like this anemic look I'll never know. They say that even the so-called epitome of WF beauty, Marilyn Monroe would be considered fat by today's standards and would never make it as a model if she were around now. To me though, I could be equally happy with a thick, rubenesque girl as I could with a petite one. As long as she's got a nice figure and she's got an attractiveness about her overall, facially and stylistically.

By Ishvara (4.54.118.63) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 08:16 pm:

Sorry for the typo Modulis!

By Ishvara (4.54.118.63) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 08:15 pm:

Modulus, I don't know what it is with the junk in the trunk as my man's called it but I know it's of the utmost importance to him. He's a man obsessed. We used to date a few years back, hadn't seen him in two years, when we got back in touch, I had lost weight now weighing 105lb. He, the best way to describe it, freaked, and he didn't rest until I am now at an appropriate weight, chunky butt. One of the most curious phenomenon to me out of all this, is that when I weighed 105lb, all the men who hit on me were white guys, and now I get all the comments from the brothas.

I'm really curious about this. What's your opinion? I wonder where this perception originates. I see it in my man, never saw it in any of the wm I've been with. The other bm I've dated was just the same about it as my guy now.

There is a big difference then having a fat flabby ass and having some back. Another terrible stereotype that irks me is the bm like "big girls" bs. Not all thankfully!

By Kansascity (209.242.125.232) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 06:33 pm:

BIG LEGGED WOMEN:

I won't go into my story about this aspect of a womens frame. My experience concerning this really doesn't matter in the big scheme of things. However, what my peers and even grown ups use to tease me about, became an asset later on.I was surprised. :-)

By Kansascity (209.242.125.232) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 06:29 pm:

Modulus:
That is a good thing that you are getting ready to graduate. Good for you. Your going to reach further and get closer to your goals.
The area where you live may not be condusive to meeting the woman that is right for you. Do some traveling. I think you said that is what your going to do next.
Have you heard of "Promise Keepers"? Before you get into a serious relationship, check out what men in this organization have to share. Their collective knowledge about taking on the serious responsibilities in life may be very helful to you in your future endeavors..

By Sheri (66.12.20.194) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 03:44 pm:

Modulis,
How old are you? You have a lot of insight to offer this site. I was surprised that you have never dated interracially. Just think what things would have been like for us 20 - 30 years ago, and we think it's still hard today! I have always been drawn to people of different color, culture. I remember when I was in grade school I was wishing so badly that I had a black girlfriend to play with and talk to. I grew up in a farming community of all white people. It was an experience for us to even see a black person. Dating black men makes me feel like people should be more accepting of me since I am hopefully considered an open minded diverse female. I have learned that not everyone thinks the way I do. I work with an older indian, Muslim woman who didn't say much at work didn't laugh or interact too much until my then boyfriend came into the office. The next day she pulled me aside and told me that she felt better knowing that my boyfriend was black. She was more comfortable and I was thrilled that I had made the slightest difference.

By Modulis (216.249.87.138) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 01:58 pm:

Sheri,

I don't know what it is, but we black men are just raised to like that "junk in the trunk." I can't give you any explanation of why we like it so much. Just like I can't give any rational explanation why big breast excite me. There is no real reason, we just love it, period! Personally, I don't like 'em as big as some black men do, it's one thing to have a big butt, and nother thing to have a huge, flabby, fat behind which I don't like. I was recently looking at some photos taken at the black biker week in S. Carolina which I guess is sorta like the black spring break and women were walking around with thongs and high shorts showing off their behind. They know that if they've got back, the brothas will fall in line.

Oh, and as to the BM grabbing you in clubs, that kind of feeds into what I was saying below about the fetish nature of BM/WW in clubs and why I don't like going to them anymore.

By Sheri (66.12.20.194) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 01:49 pm:

Ok, about the "ass thing" - what in God's name is the appeal? As a white girl going to the clubs, I can not count the times a man - black man- has touched, grabbed, squeezed, brushed or commented on my ass. Don't get me wrong, I love black men and should be thrilled that I have something that they like, besides being attractive and educated. I just don't understand what they like in a "big ol' booty". Can someone honestly tell me what it is. I wish I could get rid of some of my behind. Black men make comments to me all the time about my appearance and how good I look and about my ass. I can't remember the last time a white man paid me a compliment. As far as looking for an available white woman who is available, are you approaching her in a respectful manner or just admiring from a far. I have learned that if there is a man I see that I want to know I have to be the one to voice it and not wait on him. Most of the time he was watching, or interested and curious in me. Make the move and good luck!

By Ishvara (38.163.112.117) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 01:44 pm:

I have always had that "black girl" bottom. Used to think was a deterrment. Like it now. Fran, not sure why you have troubles, black guys seem to know instinctively that I find them attractive. Usually I'm in business attire and I'm still approached all the time. Maybe they do have the "radar" I think it has a lot to do with unconcious signals. Once I was pumping gas right after work, guy pulls up stares then says "Do you date black guys?" Shocked me a little asked why he asked me that, said he didin't know just something about me. And I can definately relate to the suit thing, first time I saw my man he was dressed like that, I think I lost my breathe, hadn't seen a more gorgeous man ever!

By Modulis (216.249.87.138) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 12:50 pm:

I thought you mentioned being in Michigan for some reason. I guess I have you confused with someone else in here.

If you've got the "ass thing" going on, oh yeah, you can be guaranteed that BM will like you. Nothing drives me crazier than a white girl with a black butt. Maybe it's something you girls are eating now, but I'm seeing more and more of them, which is certainly a good development.


Maybe you aren't going to the right places to meet BM. I'd suggest to stay out of those clubs and bars when it comes to meeting BM, I've known enough of those types and the the type of BM that go to clubs looking for white girls usually just want to satisfy a fetish. I don't know if you're in college, but that would be a great place to meet a black guy. Work might be even better since you you like us in suits!

You asked if I just like WW afar. Well, I like them from afar and I like them even better up close. But I just don't meet any that seem interested. Most of them that I like either have boyfriends already or don't seem to be interested in black guys anyway. Don't really go anywhere to meet them either. My classes at school are VERY diverse(mostly Asian I'd say) and there really aren't too many WW in any of my classes to talk to, and the few there are are taken. I am a freelance graphic designer right now, so I don't really work with people much, therefore no chances to meet women through work. And then then I really dislike going to "meet market" type places because I'd rather get to know a woman in a more relaxed environment and not some place as fast-paced as a club or bar, especially the ones here in L.A. So to be honest, I really don't even have an outlet to meet women...of any race. After I graduate in a few weeks and do a little traveling in the summer, I think I'll look for some type of 9 to 5 in workplace that has lots of women. Maybe that'll help, but with my luck, they'll probably all be engaged or have boyfriends too.

If anyone has any suggestions on good places to meet women(besides the typical stupid bars and clubs) I'm all ears. I've been thinking about this a lot. My college life will be over in a couple weeks and girl wise it brought me nothing, which is very bothersome. What would be the best thing for me to do at this point?

By Frangiapani (144.134.88.36) on Friday, May 18, 2001 - 04:06 am:

Do you live in Michigan? or do you think I live in Michigan??? cuz I dont live in michigan!...anyway, so you never dated interacially? you just like WW from afar?

Dont get me wrong, I do have black men asking me out..im just thinking maybe for the wrong reasons..how do I say this without sounding big headed??, but I guess I have the ass thing that black guys are always going on about and Im thinking they are only flirting with me because of one thing only...?

I guess Italian men are attracted to blondes? Im a dark haired blonde and italian men are always saying they like blondes because they are so different to them, I dont have guys asking me out all the time so Its not like a regular thing or anything but I just wish there were more black men doing it than the other..

About the surf wear its the same as california, skate/surf..I like black men in suits..YUM!

By Modulis (216.249.87.138) on Thursday, May 17, 2001 - 08:02 pm:

Ya know, I'm not sure what Austrailian surf wear looks like. But I know that the skater/surfer/hiphop look is kind of overlapping out here. I went to the stores up the street the other day to get some new stuff for summer. Basically everything being sold was that skater hiphop look. Baggy cargo pants, bright colored.

So more Italian guys ask you out than black men? First I didn't even realize there are too many Italian guys in Michigan. Maybe you look like an Italian? If you're from Europe I assume you have an accent, so maybe it has somethign to do with that. From what you sound like, I think you're right. I'd probably not guess that you're into brothas. And thank God you don't talk like a black girl. Not that it's a bad thing, but when white girls are talking like black girls, I find it really annoying. So how many black guys ask you out in a month? How many Italian guys? I'm just curious.

...As to me, no I'm not with anyone, never dated interracially. But that's a whole 'nother story.

By Frangiapani (144.134.91.222) on Thursday, May 17, 2001 - 06:55 pm:

My surf wear is somewhat Australian/Californian Style, some people might mistake it as hip hop, but mostly because of work and going out I mostly dress in 3/4 skirts and pretty tops so I guess I dont look like 'the type', I get a lot of italian men asking me out more so than black men so i dont know whats going on there. I can't say why Im not with a black guy at this point..it just hasn't happened yet..?! Oh well, like you said..just let it happen right? no matter what race.

Oh, my hair is just past my shoulders too, kind of wavy/straight and I dont act like a black chick either..I got a lot in common, like the music and the dancing but I dont think you could pick me out on the street or even by talking with me as liking mostly black men..!

What about you, are you with someone? How do you get along with her parents?

By Modulis (216.249.73.101) on Thursday, May 17, 2001 - 01:56 pm:

Hmmm...it's hard to say the kind of female I'm attracted to style-wise. I certainly don't dig those cornrows at all. But I do like it when white girls have braids, though I don't like dreadlocks on them. Pretty much any hairstyle goes. I prefer hair that is neither short nor very long. Something maybe just past the shoulders. I think the only women that can get away with short hair are those that have very pretty and femine faces. It works on Halle Berry, doesn't work on Janet Reno.

You were surf wear in Michigan? Hehheh... Your dressing sounds something like mine. I either dress casual half the time, or I'm wearing a Hawaiian shirt, shorts and sandals.

Don't worry if that one black guy didn't seem interested. Trust me, for every one that reacts this way to you, there are many more that wouldn't. By the way, why aren't you with a black guy now?

By Frangiapani (144.134.91.197) on Thursday, May 17, 2001 - 04:24 am:

Modulis,
What kind of female are you attracted too? If you saw a WF with cornrows would you approach her?
I dont dress hip hop but Im not plain either..I kinda dress either classy or surf wear style..and I've had black men approach me but there are a lot of black men that are only into Black women and once I talked with a black guy but he made me feel so "white" because I could tell he was only attracted to black women and that made me feel really awkward, like the white girl after black guys or something!! and it wasn't like that at all!
So you think youre screwed? Dont give up, there are also women like me out there feeling like you too!

By Modulis (216.249.83.227) on Thursday, May 17, 2001 - 02:42 am:

Almost forgot....

To Fran, I think this is less a problem for WW looking for BM than the other way around. Although I wouldn't say most black men *prefer* a white woman, I think most BM are open to dating a white woman if she is good to them. Dating out of their race simply doesn't seem to be any big deal to most BM. The ones that wouldn't are probably afraid of being called an uncle Tom by families and friends. Many BM(including me) think WW have nicer personalities and this is something the WF has in her corner. Another thing is that a WF has a good chance of getting a well off, high class BM, much to the dismay of BW. Even more upper class BM are open to IR dating than the general population.

On the other hand, it's much more difficult for us, because only a small slice of the WF population is open to dating BM. So from your end, I don't think you have much to worry about. I'd say if you saw a black guy you liked, there's an 8 in 10 chance that if he found you nice and attractive, and he didn't have a girlfriend already, he'd be yours. I only wish it was like that the other way around. :-(

So don't worry about it Fran, the odds are in your corner. If there's anyone that needs to worry, it's me. I can't deal with rejection and I'm a dark-skinned BM that loves WFs. So I'm screwed. I actually envy you.

By Modulis (216.249.83.227) on Thursday, May 17, 2001 - 02:27 am:

Sheri,

VERY interesting topic. I'm glad someone brought this up. To answer your question, many of us BM can tell when a WW is open to IR dating without ever hearing a word come out her mouth. I can't always put my finger on why, but often you can just tell. Just like gays have a "gaydar" and can just "sense" what person in a room is open to a gay relationship, somehow I can just sense which WW would probably be open or closed to a relationship with a BM. Of course my "IR radar" isn't fully accurate, I've been fooled and found out some women have dated BM that I would never have guess would. I must say though, that without seeing you, there's no way I can what it is you're doing to attract BM.

Sometimes it's the way they're dressed. If they're dressed with sort of the hiphop look that's probably a dead giveaway. I saw some white girl outside my apartment last week that had cornrows, that's certainly a giveaway. Whenever they openly show that don't seem to be afraid of black culture, style, music, etc. you can bet that they are probably open to IR dating. Sometimes just being willing to go to a club that there BM at is a clue enough.

Btw, if she looks like the plain "girl next door from Kansas" type, I wouldn't even bother in most cases.

By Sheri (66.12.20.194) on Wednesday, May 16, 2001 - 04:03 pm:

Actually, I find myself wondering, as a white female, how black men know to approach me. Is it my look am I throwing pheromones? I can't remember the last time a white man approached me. Black men approach me all the time, like they know what my preference is. Any comments out there?

By Frangiapani (203.54.154.202) on Friday, February 9, 2001 - 06:19 pm:

How can you tell if a black man is interested in a white woman? or a WW interested in a BM?, Isnt it kind of daunting to take that chance? to get that look of rejection because of your skin color? That is the one thing that freaks me out the most.